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I like to think that most people who are upset at Kubernetes don't hate on all of it. I think the configuration aspect (YAML) and the very high level of abstrac

by p-o 3y ago

I like to think that most people who are upset at Kubernetes don't hate on all of it. I think the configuration aspect (YAML) and the very high level of abstraction is what get people lost and as a result they get frustrated by it. I've certainly fall in that category while trying to learn how to operate multiple clusters using different topologies and cloud providers. But from an operational standpoint, when things are working, it usually behaves very well until you hit some rough edge cases (upgrades were much harder to achieve a couple of years back). But rough edges exist everywhere, and when I get to a point where K8s hits a problem, I would think that it would be much worse if I wasn't using it.

koolba 3y ago
> I like to think that most people who are upset at Kubernetes don't hate on all of it. I think the configuration aspect (YAML) … I question the competence of anyone who does not question (and rag on) the prevalence of templating YAML. > But rough edges exist everywhere, and when I get to a point where K8s hits a problem, I would think that it would be much worse if I wasn't using it. Damn straight. It’s only bad because everything else is strictly worse.
- dfee 3y ago
  Helm isn’t YAML. It’s a go template file that should compile to YAML, masquerading as YAML with that extension. So yaml formatters break it, humans struggle to generate code with proper indents, and it’s an insane mess. It’s horrendous.
garrettgrimsley 3y ago
>I think the configuration aspect (YAML) What are the reasons to not use JSON rather than YAML? From my admittedly-shallow experience with k8s, I have yet to encounter a situation in which I couldn't use JSON. Does this issue only pop up once you start using Helm charts?
- kbar13 3y ago
  at the surface level yaml is a lot easier to read and write for a human. less "s. but once you start using it for complex configuration it becomes unwieldy. but at that point json is also not better than yaml. after using cdk i think that writing typescript to define infra is a significantly better experience
- smokel 3y ago
  One of the most annoying limitations of JSON is that it does not allow for comments.

by p-o 3y ago

koolba 3y ago

> I like to think that most people who are upset at Kubernetes don't hate on all of it. I think the configuration aspect (YAML) … I question the competence of anyone who does not question (and rag on) the prevalence of templating YAML. > But rough edges exist everywhere, and when I get to a point where K8s hits a problem, I would think that it would be much worse if I wasn't using it. Damn straight. It’s only bad because everything else is strictly worse.

dfee 3y ago
Helm isn’t YAML. It’s a go template file that should compile to YAML, masquerading as YAML with that extension. So yaml formatters break it, humans struggle to generate code with proper indents, and it’s an insane mess. It’s horrendous.

garrettgrimsley 3y ago

>I think the configuration aspect (YAML) What are the reasons to not use JSON rather than YAML? From my admittedly-shallow experience with k8s, I have yet to encounter a situation in which I couldn't use JSON. Does this issue only pop up once you start using Helm charts?

kbar13 3y ago
at the surface level yaml is a lot easier to read and write for a human. less "s. but once you start using it for complex configuration it becomes unwieldy. but at that point json is also not better than yaml. after using cdk i think that writing typescript to define infra is a significantly better experience
smokel 3y ago
One of the most annoying limitations of JSON is that it does not allow for comments.