4 ms·

Garry Tan has a lot of X/Twitter posts on the subject. 68% of SF overdose deaths seem to happen inside shelters. Recently one of the shelter workers overdosed a

by dzink 3y ago

Garry Tan has a lot of X/Twitter posts on the subject. 68% of SF overdose deaths seem to happen inside shelters. Recently one of the shelter workers overdosed as well. There seems to be a massive disconnect between intention and consequences of policies. https://x.com/garrytan/status/1750566946201047218?s=46&t=bGAgVlSkTN1C09uVL3OifQ https://x.com/garrytan/status/1750566946201047218?s=46&t=bGA...

Geisterde 3y ago
I still believe treatment centers would be preferable, I just dont think its reasonable to expect that to happen. Requiring sobriety tests helps, I would suppose, the people that are actually interested in getting better, though many homeless allegedly avoid shelters because of the requirements. I can speculate on a few things that would reduce the rate of homelessness, economy, civil society, religion, but incarceration (where treatment is refused) seems like the only way to stop the cities from bleeding; open air drug use wouldnt be tolerated on private property (and where it is, fine, be my guest, I smoke, at home), it shouldnt be tolerated on public property either, dont be a menace.
saagarjha 3y ago
I don't have the details behind these numbers, but I wonder if the conclusion is sound? Like, a lot of people who die of sickness die in a hospital. I don't think that means that they are doing a poor job.
tacocataco 3y ago
We could legalize all drugs so people can have access to clean drugs of a known potency.
- c048 3y ago
  [flagged]
  - pikamau5 3y ago
    you're right, we should make all drugs cheap too!
    - c048 3y ago
      Good, so let's do that first before making an already terribly exploitative system even worse.
      - catlifeonmars 3y ago
        This where I think criminalization actually serves to increase exploitation and increase the incentives for exploitation.
        c048 3y ago
        I heavily disagree with that. Most legally available drugs are already out of reach for most of the homeless people (even more so in the US). These people are primarily defined by their financial status, if nothing else.
        catlifeonmars 3y ago
        Maybe we are talking about different things. I mean that criminalizing drugs tends to make their use more risky as there are fewer quality controls and no legal recourse for drug users who get low quality or downright poisonous products. Vulnerable populations, like the homeless, who are already easy to exploit, become victims of this culturally and legally defined demarcation.
        c048 3y ago
        The only way that I can see that happening is when the price would drop significantly enough so homeless people would prefer it over black-market dealers. Keep in mind that there are a lot of legal practices, or legally obtainable things, that still have a large black market. Its been historically proven again and again that people will gladly take risks or a loss in quality over affordability.
- misja111 3y ago
  Aren't most opiods legal already?

by dzink 3y ago

Geisterde 3y ago

I still believe treatment centers would be preferable, I just dont think its reasonable to expect that to happen. Requiring sobriety tests helps, I would suppose, the people that are actually interested in getting better, though many homeless allegedly avoid shelters because of the requirements. I can speculate on a few things that would reduce the rate of homelessness, economy, civil society, religion, but incarceration (where treatment is refused) seems like the only way to stop the cities from bleeding; open air drug use wouldnt be tolerated on private property (and where it is, fine, be my guest, I smoke, at home), it shouldnt be tolerated on public property either, dont be a menace.

saagarjha 3y ago

I don't have the details behind these numbers, but I wonder if the conclusion is sound? Like, a lot of people who die of sickness die in a hospital. I don't think that means that they are doing a poor job.

tacocataco 3y ago

We could legalize all drugs so people can have access to clean drugs of a known potency.

c048 3y ago
[flagged]
- pikamau5 3y ago
  you're right, we should make all drugs cheap too!
  - c048 3y ago
    Good, so let's do that first before making an already terribly exploitative system even worse.
    - catlifeonmars 3y ago
      This where I think criminalization actually serves to increase exploitation and increase the incentives for exploitation.
      - c048 3y ago
        I heavily disagree with that. Most legally available drugs are already out of reach for most of the homeless people (even more so in the US). These people are primarily defined by their financial status, if nothing else.
        catlifeonmars 3y ago
        Maybe we are talking about different things. I mean that criminalizing drugs tends to make their use more risky as there are fewer quality controls and no legal recourse for drug users who get low quality or downright poisonous products. Vulnerable populations, like the homeless, who are already easy to exploit, become victims of this culturally and legally defined demarcation.
        c048 3y ago
        The only way that I can see that happening is when the price would drop significantly enough so homeless people would prefer it over black-market dealers. Keep in mind that there are a lot of legal practices, or legally obtainable things, that still have a large black market. Its been historically proven again and again that people will gladly take risks or a loss in quality over affordability.
misja111 3y ago
Aren't most opiods legal already?