3 ms·

Who is this 'the West' and how would you expect it to monitor and protect millions of Russians amongst billions of people in hundreds of countries?

pestatije 3y ago
theres border control for a reason...if foreign hitmen can get into the country, kill someone, and get away with it, whats the point of border control?
- tonis2 3y ago
  Could of easily have been a local hitman
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]
- kazinator 3y ago
  > whats the point of border control? Harassment of ordinary people for the sake of security theatre.
  - pestatije 3y ago
    thats what im saying...all those d***heads throwing away my perfectly legal shower gel without even looking, they should be ashamed of themselves this is happening
    - kazinator 3y ago
      I went on a business trip to China some decade ago. On the way back, at the Shanghai airport, I forgot that I had an entire unopened tub of yogurt in my carry on. The security screening attendant just waved that through, like they don't give a damn. All that hoopla about liquids on planes originates from America. 9/11 didn't happen in China, so they probably think it's just some foreign bullshit they have to implement, which they do half-assedly.
  - falcor84 3y ago
    Not even security theatre, but maybe just mere nationalism/jingoism - countries create border controls to create a clearer "us vs them" mentality
- throwaway118899 3y ago
  Border control catching every hitman with the backing of an entire country… You need to stop watching CSI shows buddy.
- hackerlight 3y ago
  Border control is for plebs. Intelligence services can forge passports and use that to get in[1]. The way to stop assassinations is counter-intelligence. [1] https://www.theguardian.com/world/2010/jun/15/ireland-israeli-envoy-quit-embassy https://www.theguardian.com/world/2010/jun/15/ireland-israel...
bdjsiqoocwk 3y ago
"the West" is normally understood to be a certain collection of governments, people, ideas, and institutions. The police of Spain and Spanish intelligence would be included here. They should've made sure that the defected soldier could, if he wanted, remain totally anonymous.
- namaria 3y ago
  The Spanish government is optimized to win elections in Spain, not to secure foreign operators who appear to have defected from selected countries. This sort of armchair security policy analysis skips over reams of complexity for the sake of shaking fingers at single events that get published. The intelligence operations that succeed don't get published. If we decry western incompetence at each apparent Russian assassination, the FSB is achieving its goals.
  - anonzzzies 3y ago
    Also, why do these guys always go to Russian enclave and tourist sea side towns? It is very easy to disappear in Spain, but not in the type of places where he was killed. If you want to flee from something, you go throw a dart somewhere under or above Madrid, far from the sea. No one wants to be there, there are no Russians and the post office cannot find you so you don’t even get mail IF you register there (which you wouldn’t if you are trying to hide). For some reason people go to Marbella, or other well known mainland coastal places or, of course, Ibiza. Good for vacation (if you enjoy that type of thing), but how is it smart for disappearing of the fsb grasp.
    - namaria 3y ago
      Southern Spain is Russian organized crime playground. There are probably a lot of connections available there for all kinds of operators from Russia.
      - anonzzzies 3y ago
        Exactly. So if you are trying to get away from the Kremlin, you wouldn't go there. And yet, he did.
simonblack 3y ago
'The West' is the collection of countries comprising "The Anglophone Five Eyes", Europe and Japan as an honorary addition. What other name would you use for this bunch of people? "The West" has become the normal accepted term over the last few decades.
- namaria 3y ago
  The BRICS is also a well defined group of nations that has little in common besides some investment banker report from how their economies correlated in the early 2000s and bureaucratic plans for mutual currency swap. Naming groups of things doesn't make them a coherent whole.

pestatije 3y ago

theres border control for a reason...if foreign hitmen can get into the country, kill someone, and get away with it, whats the point of border control?

tonis2 3y ago
Could of easily have been a local hitman
deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
kazinator 3y ago
> whats the point of border control? Harassment of ordinary people for the sake of security theatre.
- pestatije 3y ago
  thats what im saying...all those d***heads throwing away my perfectly legal shower gel without even looking, they should be ashamed of themselves this is happening
  - kazinator 3y ago
    I went on a business trip to China some decade ago. On the way back, at the Shanghai airport, I forgot that I had an entire unopened tub of yogurt in my carry on. The security screening attendant just waved that through, like they don't give a damn. All that hoopla about liquids on planes originates from America. 9/11 didn't happen in China, so they probably think it's just some foreign bullshit they have to implement, which they do half-assedly.
- falcor84 3y ago
  Not even security theatre, but maybe just mere nationalism/jingoism - countries create border controls to create a clearer "us vs them" mentality
throwaway118899 3y ago
Border control catching every hitman with the backing of an entire country… You need to stop watching CSI shows buddy.
hackerlight 3y ago
Border control is for plebs. Intelligence services can forge passports and use that to get in[1]. The way to stop assassinations is counter-intelligence. [1] https://www.theguardian.com/world/2010/jun/15/ireland-israeli-envoy-quit-embassy https://www.theguardian.com/world/2010/jun/15/ireland-israel...

bdjsiqoocwk 3y ago

"the West" is normally understood to be a certain collection of governments, people, ideas, and institutions. The police of Spain and Spanish intelligence would be included here. They should've made sure that the defected soldier could, if he wanted, remain totally anonymous.

namaria 3y ago
The Spanish government is optimized to win elections in Spain, not to secure foreign operators who appear to have defected from selected countries. This sort of armchair security policy analysis skips over reams of complexity for the sake of shaking fingers at single events that get published. The intelligence operations that succeed don't get published. If we decry western incompetence at each apparent Russian assassination, the FSB is achieving its goals.
- anonzzzies 3y ago
  Also, why do these guys always go to Russian enclave and tourist sea side towns? It is very easy to disappear in Spain, but not in the type of places where he was killed. If you want to flee from something, you go throw a dart somewhere under or above Madrid, far from the sea. No one wants to be there, there are no Russians and the post office cannot find you so you don’t even get mail IF you register there (which you wouldn’t if you are trying to hide). For some reason people go to Marbella, or other well known mainland coastal places or, of course, Ibiza. Good for vacation (if you enjoy that type of thing), but how is it smart for disappearing of the fsb grasp.
  - namaria 3y ago
    Southern Spain is Russian organized crime playground. There are probably a lot of connections available there for all kinds of operators from Russia.
    - anonzzzies 3y ago
      Exactly. So if you are trying to get away from the Kremlin, you wouldn't go there. And yet, he did.

simonblack 3y ago

'The West' is the collection of countries comprising "The Anglophone Five Eyes", Europe and Japan as an honorary addition. What other name would you use for this bunch of people? "The West" has become the normal accepted term over the last few decades.

namaria 3y ago
The BRICS is also a well defined group of nations that has little in common besides some investment banker report from how their economies correlated in the early 2000s and bureaucratic plans for mutual currency swap. Naming groups of things doesn't make them a coherent whole.