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I think my previous comment was very clear: developers should get to choose. If they want to pay a high commission for easy payments they should be able to. If

I think my previous comment was very clear: developers should get to choose. If they want to pay a high commission for easy payments they should be able to. If they want to introduce greater friction for a lower cut they should be allowed to do that too. Apple expressly forbids this in native apps. If the PWA platform were more viable it would offer this choice but it isn’t, an Apple has a vested interest in things staying that way. At the very same time they defend their restrictions upon native apps in court citing the web as an alternative platform. It’s very convenient.

scarface_74 3y ago
Okay, developers can choose on Android. Yet to a first approximation, all of them still use the Google Play Store, why is that? If it’s only mean old Apple stopping developers from using PWAs, then why do Android developers still use Google Play services instead of PWAs, alternate app stores or direct downloads? All of which are available? Candy Crush - still one of the most profitable games in the App Store is not graphic intensive and could be done on the web today and use Apple Pay (normal credit card charges), why don’t they?
- afavour 3y ago
  Because Candy Crush relies upon being an impulse purchase. If people had to go through five steps to buy it a ton of people would abandon it. That isn’t the same for every app. There are plenty of apps folks would be happy to go out of their way to purchase because they provide a ton of value. But the developers are not allowed to. Again: my argument here is choice. Let developers decide. Your counter is “but one of them is better”. You’re entitled to your opinion but that isn’t a counter argument to letting developers choose what type of payment system they want to use. Apple does not let developers do that and they should. There’s really not much more to the debate than that. If, as you argue, Apple’s ecosystem is better in all aspects then it will win out in a free market. What’s not to like?
  - scarface_74 3y ago
    > Because Candy Crush relies upon being an impulse purchase. If people had to go through five steps to buy it a ton of people would abandon it. But this does apply to apps that make up 90% of the revenue on the App Store. These aren’t numbers I’m making up - it came out in the Epic trial. But even if that’s not the case for the other 10%, the same would apply for the App Store that applies for Amazon in the real world. Smaller merchants still choose Amazon for the conversion and that’s where the customers are when literally anyone can sell from a Squarespace website. > Again: my argument here is choice. Let developers decide. Your counter is “but one of them is better”. You’re entitled to your opinion but that isn’t a counter argument to letting developers choose what type of payment system And that’s the issue - everyone wants to use Apple’s App Store and have their own payment system not avoid the exposure they get from the App Store. Once again, on Android where you can in fact tell users to go outside of the Google ay Store - hardly anyone does. Every Indy developer thinks their little app will be special and they would be okay outside of the App Store. If they can’t even gain traction within the App Store what chances do they have of gaining traction outside of it? It’s not the 15% cut that’s keeping them from succeeding - small developers aren’t paying 30%
    - danShumway 3y ago
      As a reminder, both Android and Amazon are being investigated for antitrust, and part of that complaint for Amazon is that they utilized an algorithm called Project Nessie to raise prices across the web for consumer goods even on 3rd-party storefronts: https://fortune.com/2023/11/02/amazon-algorithm-raise-prices-ftc-antitrust-lawsuit/ https://fortune.com/2023/11/02/amazon-algorithm-raise-prices... These are maybe not the shining corporate examples you want to compare Apple to.
      - scarface_74 3y ago
        Google is being sued because they sold the idea of “freeduhm” and then changed the terms. There is plenty of precedence for this. This is why they loss thr Epic case and Apple won a similar lawsuit. But how is what Amazon doing any different than what the corner store does when it raises and lowers gas prices based on competition? And before you accuse me of being an Amazon apologist, I’ve mentioned plenty of times that I got Amazoned last year. I have no love loss for the company.

scarface_74 3y ago

Okay, developers can choose on Android. Yet to a first approximation, all of them still use the Google Play Store, why is that? If it’s only mean old Apple stopping developers from using PWAs, then why do Android developers still use Google Play services instead of PWAs, alternate app stores or direct downloads? All of which are available? Candy Crush - still one of the most profitable games in the App Store is not graphic intensive and could be done on the web today and use Apple Pay (normal credit card charges), why don’t they?

afavour 3y ago
Because Candy Crush relies upon being an impulse purchase. If people had to go through five steps to buy it a ton of people would abandon it. That isn’t the same for every app. There are plenty of apps folks would be happy to go out of their way to purchase because they provide a ton of value. But the developers are not allowed to. Again: my argument here is choice. Let developers decide. Your counter is “but one of them is better”. You’re entitled to your opinion but that isn’t a counter argument to letting developers choose what type of payment system they want to use. Apple does not let developers do that and they should. There’s really not much more to the debate than that. If, as you argue, Apple’s ecosystem is better in all aspects then it will win out in a free market. What’s not to like?
- scarface_74 3y ago
  > Because Candy Crush relies upon being an impulse purchase. If people had to go through five steps to buy it a ton of people would abandon it. But this does apply to apps that make up 90% of the revenue on the App Store. These aren’t numbers I’m making up - it came out in the Epic trial. But even if that’s not the case for the other 10%, the same would apply for the App Store that applies for Amazon in the real world. Smaller merchants still choose Amazon for the conversion and that’s where the customers are when literally anyone can sell from a Squarespace website. > Again: my argument here is choice. Let developers decide. Your counter is “but one of them is better”. You’re entitled to your opinion but that isn’t a counter argument to letting developers choose what type of payment system And that’s the issue - everyone wants to use Apple’s App Store and have their own payment system not avoid the exposure they get from the App Store. Once again, on Android where you can in fact tell users to go outside of the Google ay Store - hardly anyone does. Every Indy developer thinks their little app will be special and they would be okay outside of the App Store. If they can’t even gain traction within the App Store what chances do they have of gaining traction outside of it? It’s not the 15% cut that’s keeping them from succeeding - small developers aren’t paying 30%
  - danShumway 3y ago
    As a reminder, both Android and Amazon are being investigated for antitrust, and part of that complaint for Amazon is that they utilized an algorithm called Project Nessie to raise prices across the web for consumer goods even on 3rd-party storefronts: https://fortune.com/2023/11/02/amazon-algorithm-raise-prices-ftc-antitrust-lawsuit/ https://fortune.com/2023/11/02/amazon-algorithm-raise-prices... These are maybe not the shining corporate examples you want to compare Apple to.
    - scarface_74 3y ago
      Google is being sued because they sold the idea of “freeduhm” and then changed the terms. There is plenty of precedence for this. This is why they loss thr Epic case and Apple won a similar lawsuit. But how is what Amazon doing any different than what the corner store does when it raises and lowers gas prices based on competition? And before you accuse me of being an Amazon apologist, I’ve mentioned plenty of times that I got Amazoned last year. I have no love loss for the company.