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I develop a lot UI apps (mostly Angular) and these days I just use a framework like Bootstrap or Foundation. The myriad of layout options in pure CSS is overwhe

I develop a lot UI apps (mostly Angular) and these days I just use a framework like Bootstrap or Foundation. The myriad of layout options in pure CSS is overwhelming and mind boggling, especially when it comes to responsive design. I have tried using pure CSS but find myself writing lots of boilerplate code and coming up with amounts to a mini framework. Unless you’re designing a custom bespoke designer web site, I don’t personally see the need for constantly reinventing the wheel.

rzmmm 3y ago
Newer CSS features like flexbox, grid and media queries were added to reduce the need for frameworks like bootstrap.
- chiefalchemist 3y ago
  Yes and no. The key selling point of Bootstrap (and similar) was that a design-blind (so to speak) backend dev/eng could use it and would have to work very hard to "design" something that was ugly, hard to look at, hard to use, etc. Sure there are a bunch of helper classes, and such, but the key is an end product that does look like a backend dev/eng built it.
- temporallobe 3y ago
  Frameworks still do a lot of the grunt work for the responsive breakpoints.
chrysoprace 3y ago
There's still some boilerplate, but I'm a big fan of Open Props[0] because it takes a hybrid approach. CSS isn't necessarily reinventing the wheel, but allowing for easier / more powerful approaches to difficult layouts or things that would otherwise require JS. Bootstrap is fine but troubleshooting advanced layout issues involves a lot of inspecting elements to see what styles are actually being applied (at least in my experience, YMMV) so I'd personally always bet on CSS. A new feature that I'm excited about is the `@scope` rule which is going to make scoped styles a lot easier. [0] https://open-props.style/ https://open-props.style/ [1] https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web/CSS/@scope https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web/CSS/@scope

rzmmm 3y ago

Newer CSS features like flexbox, grid and media queries were added to reduce the need for frameworks like bootstrap.

chiefalchemist 3y ago
Yes and no. The key selling point of Bootstrap (and similar) was that a design-blind (so to speak) backend dev/eng could use it and would have to work very hard to "design" something that was ugly, hard to look at, hard to use, etc. Sure there are a bunch of helper classes, and such, but the key is an end product that does look like a backend dev/eng built it.
temporallobe 3y ago
Frameworks still do a lot of the grunt work for the responsive breakpoints.

chrysoprace 3y ago

There's still some boilerplate, but I'm a big fan of Open Props[0] because it takes a hybrid approach. CSS isn't necessarily reinventing the wheel, but allowing for easier / more powerful approaches to difficult layouts or things that would otherwise require JS. Bootstrap is fine but troubleshooting advanced layout issues involves a lot of inspecting elements to see what styles are actually being applied (at least in my experience, YMMV) so I'd personally always bet on CSS. A new feature that I'm excited about is the `@scope` rule which is going to make scoped styles a lot easier. [0] https://open-props.style/ https://open-props.style/ [1] https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web/CSS/@scope https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web/CSS/@scope