4 ms·

>just because we have credit cards doesn't mean we use them I concur, using credit cards is rather dangerous, especially online and in app forms for both buyer

>just because we have credit cards doesn't mean we use them I concur, using credit cards is rather dangerous, especially online and in app forms for both buyer and seller alike [6]. >SEPA based payments work out far better Indeed, but since recently (2018?) European banks couldn't confiscate your money on a whim, like the US credit card companies did for decades. Now European banks do too, just like PayPal [4]. Enshittfication was first coined by Cory Doctorrow [3] here [2] and it applies everywhere now [1]. [1] https://www.ft.com/content/6fb1602d-a08b-4a8c-bac0-047b7d64aba5 https://www.ft.com/content/6fb1602d-a08b-4a8c-bac0-047b7d64a... [2] https://doctorow.medium.com/social-quitting-1ce85b67b456 https://doctorow.medium.com/social-quitting-1ce85b67b456 [3] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enshittification https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enshittification [4] https://emerchantauthority.com/blog/what-to-do-if-your-paypal-account-gets-frozen/#:~:text=the%20resolution%20centre.-,Why%20PayPal%20Freeze%20PayPal%20account%3F,or%20to%20comply%20with%20regulations https://emerchantauthority.com/blog/what-to-do-if-your-paypa.... [5] https://hn.algolia.com/?q=freeze+bank https://hn.algolia.com/?q=freeze+bank [6] https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&query=chargeback&sort=byPopularity&type=story https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&que...

relativ575 3y ago
> I concur, using credit cards is rather dangerous Your link is about chargeback. I'm pretty much exclusively using credit cards for daily payment and I can't even remember the last time I got any problems. I never pay interest either. I get that you don't like or trust credit card, and it isn't popular in Europe, but don't be generalizing. Even in Europe my credit cards work well, except for the unpopularity of Amex.
- morphle 3y ago
  >I get that you don't like or trust credit card I do not get why people insist on defending the credit card companies and their ungoing enshittification and changing rules and laws[1]. I would prefer you refuting my central argument[2]. Credit card laws and rules have many more problems than just chargebacks. For two decades online payment webpages stole credit card numbers and stole money from people. I could list many more documented cases. Elsewhere someone argues that debit cards are not credit cards. I agree. Of course Starlink forms reject debit cards too. [1] https://consumer.ftc.gov/articles/when-company-declines-your-credit-or-debit-card https://consumer.ftc.gov/articles/when-company-declines-your... [2] https://paulgraham.com/disagree.html https://paulgraham.com/disagree.html
  - rescbr 3y ago
    > For two decades online payment webpages stole credit card numbers and stole money from people. I could list many more documented cases. In this case, it's better than debit cards as you are not out of money until the bank reverts the fraudulent charge. Now with 3DS this is way better, but I am way wearier of using my debit card number online (so I generate temporary cards) compared to credit - if they steal the card number, there is no problem.

relativ575 3y ago

> I concur, using credit cards is rather dangerous Your link is about chargeback. I'm pretty much exclusively using credit cards for daily payment and I can't even remember the last time I got any problems. I never pay interest either. I get that you don't like or trust credit card, and it isn't popular in Europe, but don't be generalizing. Even in Europe my credit cards work well, except for the unpopularity of Amex.

morphle 3y ago
>I get that you don't like or trust credit card I do not get why people insist on defending the credit card companies and their ungoing enshittification and changing rules and laws[1]. I would prefer you refuting my central argument[2]. Credit card laws and rules have many more problems than just chargebacks. For two decades online payment webpages stole credit card numbers and stole money from people. I could list many more documented cases. Elsewhere someone argues that debit cards are not credit cards. I agree. Of course Starlink forms reject debit cards too. [1] https://consumer.ftc.gov/articles/when-company-declines-your-credit-or-debit-card https://consumer.ftc.gov/articles/when-company-declines-your... [2] https://paulgraham.com/disagree.html https://paulgraham.com/disagree.html
- rescbr 3y ago
  > For two decades online payment webpages stole credit card numbers and stole money from people. I could list many more documented cases. In this case, it's better than debit cards as you are not out of money until the bank reverts the fraudulent charge. Now with 3DS this is way better, but I am way wearier of using my debit card number online (so I generate temporary cards) compared to credit - if they steal the card number, there is no problem.