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Filling out any form for the federal government is actually a big deal, because you incur huge legal liability by being wrong (criminal, if they decide you were

Filling out any form for the federal government is actually a big deal, because you incur huge legal liability by being wrong (criminal, if they decide you were lying). Submitting regulatory documents goes through a lot of legal review for a reason, you can't just "spitball" the numbers.

ToucanLoucan 3y ago
Baloney. Any government form I've filled out gives that vibe, sure. And then when you're wrong, you don't get a fucking prison sentence, you get a phone call where someone explains why they think you're wrong and asks you to take a stab at it. Also, every form from the Government I've ever filled out that is binding in terms of accuracy goes out of it's way, where you sign (which this one, to my looking, I don't even see where you sign!) to say that "you certify that this information is accurate and correct to the best of your knowledge which like, the deniability there is a mile fucking wide. I, personally, as a citizen of both the United States and the larger world would very much like to know how much energy is being pissed away on crypto nonsense. I don't care if that's hard for you, if you can't be arsed to fill out a form, then shut down your stupid mining rigs. Edit: For an example of this: I straight up forgot to include a large gift from a family member in my taxes one year. I never once saw a cop, was threatened, or anything else: I got two letters, one from the IRS, and one from the state, detailing that they found I had forgotten it during an audit, and I owed them.... IIRC it was a G and a half, thereabouts. If I disagreed and wanted to question their findings, I had to reply with the requisite documentation and a signed statement explaining why I felt what I did. If not, I could accept the judgement, and they included the paperwork to setup a payment plan if I couldn't afford it right away. This "big government so scary" shit just is not reality. Every government institution I've dealt with (apart from the police, of course) approaches everyone in good faith, arguably even when they shouldn't. The ONLY way you can really get the G-men on your ass is if you're purposely going out of your way and doing fraudulent or illegal shit. Like the IRS doesn't even give a damn if you sell drugs, they just demand Uncle Sam gets his cut.
- yownie 3y ago
  sure just as long as you shut down your dumb video games and movie distribution network.
- NovemberWhiskey 3y ago
  >I, personally, as a citizen of both the United States and the larger world would very much like to know how much energy is being pissed away on crypto nonsense. I would like to know that too, but I also want my government to adhere to the laws which govern how it can generate paperwork and force me to incur compliance costs. So let's have both, huh?
  - ToucanLoucan 3y ago
    The "compliance cost" here being a 2 page form that takes a half an hour? Where do you want the check sent?
    - NovemberWhiskey 3y ago
      I want the rule of law, not a check - what exactly are you looking for?
- UncleEntity 3y ago
  The IRS used to be absolutely brutal in their enforcement efforts. Umm, full stop.
  - rangerelf 3y ago
    Do you have any documented examples of this behavior?
  - tekla 3y ago
    Bullshit. I've been audited 3 times because of my inexperience with running a business. Every single time it was a professionally worded letter that told me exactly what I needed to do to fix it, and when I followed directions, the problem went away.
spdustin 3y ago
There are many instances of "please provide your best estimate" on the forms, which provides a lot of reasonable doubt for any attempt to prosecute fraud. Besides, the rest of the data required on the forms is almost certainly readily available on monthly invoices from energy providers and suppliers (for the bulk of each Schedule 2's fields), an Excel inventory of their mining units, and a Grafana dashboard showing hash rate and load. These are the bare minimum data they'd have readily available just to ensure profitability in the first place.
- reaperman 3y ago
  It doesn't have a field to specify which cryptocurrency you are mining. Which makes the "hash rate" field almost meaningless. This form won't even collect good data.

ToucanLoucan 3y ago

Baloney. Any government form I've filled out gives that vibe, sure. And then when you're wrong, you don't get a fucking prison sentence, you get a phone call where someone explains why they think you're wrong and asks you to take a stab at it. Also, every form from the Government I've ever filled out that is binding in terms of accuracy goes out of it's way, where you sign (which this one, to my looking, I don't even see where you sign!) to say that "you certify that this information is accurate and correct to the best of your knowledge which like, the deniability there is a mile fucking wide. I, personally, as a citizen of both the United States and the larger world would very much like to know how much energy is being pissed away on crypto nonsense. I don't care if that's hard for you, if you can't be arsed to fill out a form, then shut down your stupid mining rigs. Edit: For an example of this: I straight up forgot to include a large gift from a family member in my taxes one year. I never once saw a cop, was threatened, or anything else: I got two letters, one from the IRS, and one from the state, detailing that they found I had forgotten it during an audit, and I owed them.... IIRC it was a G and a half, thereabouts. If I disagreed and wanted to question their findings, I had to reply with the requisite documentation and a signed statement explaining why I felt what I did. If not, I could accept the judgement, and they included the paperwork to setup a payment plan if I couldn't afford it right away. This "big government so scary" shit just is not reality. Every government institution I've dealt with (apart from the police, of course) approaches everyone in good faith, arguably even when they shouldn't. The ONLY way you can really get the G-men on your ass is if you're purposely going out of your way and doing fraudulent or illegal shit. Like the IRS doesn't even give a damn if you sell drugs, they just demand Uncle Sam gets his cut.

yownie 3y ago
sure just as long as you shut down your dumb video games and movie distribution network.
NovemberWhiskey 3y ago
>I, personally, as a citizen of both the United States and the larger world would very much like to know how much energy is being pissed away on crypto nonsense. I would like to know that too, but I also want my government to adhere to the laws which govern how it can generate paperwork and force me to incur compliance costs. So let's have both, huh?
- ToucanLoucan 3y ago
  The "compliance cost" here being a 2 page form that takes a half an hour? Where do you want the check sent?
  - NovemberWhiskey 3y ago
    I want the rule of law, not a check - what exactly are you looking for?
UncleEntity 3y ago
The IRS used to be absolutely brutal in their enforcement efforts. Umm, full stop.
- rangerelf 3y ago
  Do you have any documented examples of this behavior?
- tekla 3y ago
  Bullshit. I've been audited 3 times because of my inexperience with running a business. Every single time it was a professionally worded letter that told me exactly what I needed to do to fix it, and when I followed directions, the problem went away.

spdustin 3y ago

There are many instances of "please provide your best estimate" on the forms, which provides a lot of reasonable doubt for any attempt to prosecute fraud. Besides, the rest of the data required on the forms is almost certainly readily available on monthly invoices from energy providers and suppliers (for the bulk of each Schedule 2's fields), an Excel inventory of their mining units, and a Grafana dashboard showing hash rate and load. These are the bare minimum data they'd have readily available just to ensure profitability in the first place.

reaperman 3y ago
It doesn't have a field to specify which cryptocurrency you are mining. Which makes the "hash rate" field almost meaningless. This form won't even collect good data.