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> almost everything I've ever worked with that was run by the Apache foundation turned out to be semi-abandoned disasterware over time Can you name a few exam

> almost everything I've ever worked with that was run by the Apache foundation turned out to be semi-abandoned disasterware over time Can you name a few examples?

bombcar 3y ago
Here's the list: https://projects.apache.org/projects.html?name https://projects.apache.org/projects.html?name OpenOffice is probably the most famous (it still has the name, but it is dead, LibreOffice is the real "active" fork). And the things in the "Attic" are officially dead - https://projects.apache.org/committee.html?attic https://projects.apache.org/committee.html?attic and many more projects should be there.
- lars_francke 3y ago
  I think it's a great feature to have explicit lifecycle for open source projects. Lots of other projects just die silently and/or you are unsure of the status. Here you at least have a chance to revive them if you like as there is always an overarching organisation.
  - bombcar 3y ago
    The problem really is that some Apache projects are actually alive (Apache itself, apparently Superset, Groovy, etc) and some appear alive at first glance. More things should move into the Attic, like OpenOffice.
smaudet 3y ago
Ivy, Netbeans, Open Office, Shiro, Solr all jump at me off this list: https://projects.apache.org/projects.html?name https://projects.apache.org/projects.html?name These are all projects that once were (more) relevant, however seem to have become rather niche (Gradle, Jetbrains/VSCode, GoogleDocs/Libreoffice e.g. for the first three are the dominant competitors). Most of these projects (like the massive commons listings) are either used by some Java library somewhere (meaning their success/relevance is tied to the usage of Java), or are obscure enough that they are no longer used widely and so suffer from lack of interest. There are gems in this list, to be sure, but if you just run into half-maintained projects all the time you're not likely to associate good things with the Apache name?
noduerme 3y ago
Well, OpenOffice as I said. Cordova is/was a hot mess (with some nice pioneering features, just really not well maintained imo and felt like quicksand to build even a small app on) Then the sort of long slow death of Flex (now Royale?) Apache seems like where software no one loves anymore goes to die.
- rpeden 3y ago
  I suppose it depends on projects you're using. For many developers their primary exposure to the Apache Foundation is through projects like Maven and Kafka, and those certainly don't feel dead.

> almost everything I've ever worked with that was run by the Apache foundation turned out to be semi-abandoned disasterware over time Can you name a few examples?

bombcar 3y ago

Here's the list: https://projects.apache.org/projects.html?name https://projects.apache.org/projects.html?name OpenOffice is probably the most famous (it still has the name, but it is dead, LibreOffice is the real "active" fork). And the things in the "Attic" are officially dead - https://projects.apache.org/committee.html?attic https://projects.apache.org/committee.html?attic and many more projects should be there.

lars_francke 3y ago
I think it's a great feature to have explicit lifecycle for open source projects. Lots of other projects just die silently and/or you are unsure of the status. Here you at least have a chance to revive them if you like as there is always an overarching organisation.
- bombcar 3y ago
  The problem really is that some Apache projects are actually alive (Apache itself, apparently Superset, Groovy, etc) and some appear alive at first glance. More things should move into the Attic, like OpenOffice.

smaudet 3y ago

Ivy, Netbeans, Open Office, Shiro, Solr all jump at me off this list: https://projects.apache.org/projects.html?name https://projects.apache.org/projects.html?name These are all projects that once were (more) relevant, however seem to have become rather niche (Gradle, Jetbrains/VSCode, GoogleDocs/Libreoffice e.g. for the first three are the dominant competitors). Most of these projects (like the massive commons listings) are either used by some Java library somewhere (meaning their success/relevance is tied to the usage of Java), or are obscure enough that they are no longer used widely and so suffer from lack of interest. There are gems in this list, to be sure, but if you just run into half-maintained projects all the time you're not likely to associate good things with the Apache name?

noduerme 3y ago

Well, OpenOffice as I said. Cordova is/was a hot mess (with some nice pioneering features, just really not well maintained imo and felt like quicksand to build even a small app on) Then the sort of long slow death of Flex (now Royale?) Apache seems like where software no one loves anymore goes to die.

rpeden 3y ago
I suppose it depends on projects you're using. For many developers their primary exposure to the Apache Foundation is through projects like Maven and Kafka, and those certainly don't feel dead.