5 ms·

There needs to be a law that, for any kind of Chinese seafood to be imported, foreign officials must be allowed to inspect the conditions. They already do it fo

There needs to be a law that, for any kind of Chinese seafood to be imported, foreign officials must be allowed to inspect the conditions. They already do it for food safety. When espionage laws make other monitoring impossible, there can be zero trust in these companies to do the right thing. Allow detailed, random inspections, or your imports are blocked and you make no money.

Reubachi 3y ago
Do you think this does not happen? Do you think there is any way to make this happen in a more transparent/satisfactory manner? (IE, more batch auditing) Do you think that, if there was total 100 percent auditing/QA of every single "peice" of seafood, this problem would go away? IE; this already happens, and is why customs and border patrol exist. There doesn't need to be a law targetting one specificc boogeyman, the policies are frameworks already exist. Most border patrol do not work the southern border for migrants, they work ports to audit and investigate all imports. Weather that works or not is another question, and you should ask your state reps.
vlovich123 3y ago
Just to be clear, as outlined in the article both US and UN require inspections and these plants are “certified”. Clearly the inspectors do jack all. On the other hand, I’m curious how these investigators get all these local managers to give them tours of these plants and be so open like that. Like if a stranger shows up at my work and asks for a tour (whether or not it’s media), I’m not just going to give them a tour.
- khuey 3y ago
  > I’m curious how these investigators get all these local managers to give them tours of these plants and be so open like that. Bribes?
  - throwaway290 3y ago
    Not necessarily, you just pretend to be a buyer.
    - zoklet-enjoyer 3y ago
      This. They'll give a tour to someone who wants to do business with them. It's not like it's hard to lie about being a seafood distributor.
- overstay8930 3y ago
  > Like if a stranger shows up at my work and asks for a tour (whether or not it’s media), I’m not just going to give them a tour. You would if you got paid in Monopoly money and they offered you USD
IG_Semmelweiss 3y ago
You dont need a new law. Just work with what you have. 1 raise tariffs on chinese goods. 2 undo massive regulatory red tape on all american industry. 3 enjoy fair trade transparent production of US sourced goods Thw differential cost between still cheaper chinese goods with heavy tariffs and us good suject to heavy tax rate is more than covered by 3PL, shipping costs and supply chain delays. You dont need to make productive costs similar all you need is to make producing in US marginally more competitive.
- purplezooey 3y ago
  I don't think most people would assess the current state of industrial regulations in the US as having "massive regulatory red tape."
  - tyre 3y ago
    Building nuclear plants here is unbelievably difficult compared with similar countries.
    - Moru 3y ago
      That is interesting to know because that is used as an argument in other countries too.
      - pas 3y ago
        So on one hand, the regulatory framework is ridiculously anti-innovation, and changing it is hard, and it's bad bad bad. https://thebreakthrough.org/blog/waiting-on-the-nuclear-regulatory-commission-eight-months-after-receiving-proposed-advanced-reactor-licensing-rule-commission-has-not-acted https://thebreakthrough.org/blog/waiting-on-the-nuclear-regu... but, the big cost overruns and the whole cost disease is because of atrocious change management, lack of standardization and, in general, bad project management. https://www.cell.com/joule/fulltext/S2542-4351(20)30458-X https://www.cell.com/joule/fulltext/S2542-4351(20)30458-X ( https://news.mit.edu/2020/reasons-nuclear-overruns-1118 https://news.mit.edu/2020/reasons-nuclear-overruns-1118 )
jimt1234 3y ago
When I lived in China years ago, I had a Chinese/local girlfriend whose brother-in-law owned a factory that "manufactured" small mechanical parts, like bolts, screws, springs, wire - stuff like that. She said that all the manufacturing was actually done in North Korea. The "factory" that he owned in China was all for show. He always knew when inspectors were coming, days in advance, and so he'd hire a few locals for a day to stand next to machines they had no idea how to use. It was all for show. She went on to tell me that her brother-in-law's factory was not unique. Manufacturers like her brother-in-law were usually 3 or 4 distribution companies removed from the big manufacturers, like the ones that made iPhones, but they all used parts from him, so inspections were extremely rare anyway.
- Sabinus 3y ago
  Pre-warned inspections aren't inspections. The government or investigator should just show up at the door.
  - karolist 3y ago
    The idea I believe is to do so, but corruption makes these pre-warned anyway.
  - eviks 3y ago
    Pre-warning is not an issue of your inspector is so incompetent he can't tell a real factory from a fake one
    - 93po 3y ago
      It’s more likely money passing hands and a very nice dinner out for the inspector who really doesn’t care because he knows actually doing his job won’t make any difference
- csomar 3y ago
  I'd be suspicious. Are you saying that China exports/production is actually coming from North Korea; because based on that North Korea would be the actual super power. My guess is that this is a rather limited trade that on the scale of things (700million chinese workers vs 100K North Korean) is really negligible.
ornornor 3y ago
> Chinese seafood After reading The Outlaw Ocean[0] by the article’s author, it’s clear to me there is no ethical seafood. The overwhelming majority of it comes from natural reserves where fishing is prohibited, depleting marine ecosystems, and fished by slaves who are prisoners on their fishing boats. One more reason (on top of heavy metal pollution, bottom trawling, human rights issues, bycatch, marine ecosystems destruction) for me to not eat seafood. Yes there is a microscopic chance you know of an edge case where the seafood is catches using traditional methods in sustainable quantities by a business that is virtuous… that’s not the seafood you’ll get in most supermarkets or restaurants anywhere in the world. [0]: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Outlaw_Ocean https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Outlaw_Ocean

Reubachi 3y ago

Do you think this does not happen? Do you think there is any way to make this happen in a more transparent/satisfactory manner? (IE, more batch auditing) Do you think that, if there was total 100 percent auditing/QA of every single "peice" of seafood, this problem would go away? IE; this already happens, and is why customs and border patrol exist. There doesn't need to be a law targetting one specificc boogeyman, the policies are frameworks already exist. Most border patrol do not work the southern border for migrants, they work ports to audit and investigate all imports. Weather that works or not is another question, and you should ask your state reps.

vlovich123 3y ago

Just to be clear, as outlined in the article both US and UN require inspections and these plants are “certified”. Clearly the inspectors do jack all. On the other hand, I’m curious how these investigators get all these local managers to give them tours of these plants and be so open like that. Like if a stranger shows up at my work and asks for a tour (whether or not it’s media), I’m not just going to give them a tour.

khuey 3y ago
> I’m curious how these investigators get all these local managers to give them tours of these plants and be so open like that. Bribes?
- throwaway290 3y ago
  Not necessarily, you just pretend to be a buyer.
  - zoklet-enjoyer 3y ago
    This. They'll give a tour to someone who wants to do business with them. It's not like it's hard to lie about being a seafood distributor.
overstay8930 3y ago
> Like if a stranger shows up at my work and asks for a tour (whether or not it’s media), I’m not just going to give them a tour. You would if you got paid in Monopoly money and they offered you USD

IG_Semmelweiss 3y ago

You dont need a new law. Just work with what you have. 1 raise tariffs on chinese goods. 2 undo massive regulatory red tape on all american industry. 3 enjoy fair trade transparent production of US sourced goods Thw differential cost between still cheaper chinese goods with heavy tariffs and us good suject to heavy tax rate is more than covered by 3PL, shipping costs and supply chain delays. You dont need to make productive costs similar all you need is to make producing in US marginally more competitive.

purplezooey 3y ago
I don't think most people would assess the current state of industrial regulations in the US as having "massive regulatory red tape."
- tyre 3y ago
  Building nuclear plants here is unbelievably difficult compared with similar countries.
  - Moru 3y ago
    That is interesting to know because that is used as an argument in other countries too.
    - pas 3y ago
      So on one hand, the regulatory framework is ridiculously anti-innovation, and changing it is hard, and it's bad bad bad. https://thebreakthrough.org/blog/waiting-on-the-nuclear-regulatory-commission-eight-months-after-receiving-proposed-advanced-reactor-licensing-rule-commission-has-not-acted https://thebreakthrough.org/blog/waiting-on-the-nuclear-regu... but, the big cost overruns and the whole cost disease is because of atrocious change management, lack of standardization and, in general, bad project management. https://www.cell.com/joule/fulltext/S2542-4351(20)30458-X https://www.cell.com/joule/fulltext/S2542-4351(20)30458-X ( https://news.mit.edu/2020/reasons-nuclear-overruns-1118 https://news.mit.edu/2020/reasons-nuclear-overruns-1118 )

jimt1234 3y ago

When I lived in China years ago, I had a Chinese/local girlfriend whose brother-in-law owned a factory that "manufactured" small mechanical parts, like bolts, screws, springs, wire - stuff like that. She said that all the manufacturing was actually done in North Korea. The "factory" that he owned in China was all for show. He always knew when inspectors were coming, days in advance, and so he'd hire a few locals for a day to stand next to machines they had no idea how to use. It was all for show. She went on to tell me that her brother-in-law's factory was not unique. Manufacturers like her brother-in-law were usually 3 or 4 distribution companies removed from the big manufacturers, like the ones that made iPhones, but they all used parts from him, so inspections were extremely rare anyway.

Sabinus 3y ago
Pre-warned inspections aren't inspections. The government or investigator should just show up at the door.
- karolist 3y ago
  The idea I believe is to do so, but corruption makes these pre-warned anyway.
- eviks 3y ago
  Pre-warning is not an issue of your inspector is so incompetent he can't tell a real factory from a fake one
  - 93po 3y ago
    It’s more likely money passing hands and a very nice dinner out for the inspector who really doesn’t care because he knows actually doing his job won’t make any difference
csomar 3y ago
I'd be suspicious. Are you saying that China exports/production is actually coming from North Korea; because based on that North Korea would be the actual super power. My guess is that this is a rather limited trade that on the scale of things (700million chinese workers vs 100K North Korean) is really negligible.

ornornor 3y ago

> Chinese seafood After reading The Outlaw Ocean[0] by the article’s author, it’s clear to me there is no ethical seafood. The overwhelming majority of it comes from natural reserves where fishing is prohibited, depleting marine ecosystems, and fished by slaves who are prisoners on their fishing boats. One more reason (on top of heavy metal pollution, bottom trawling, human rights issues, bycatch, marine ecosystems destruction) for me to not eat seafood. Yes there is a microscopic chance you know of an edge case where the seafood is catches using traditional methods in sustainable quantities by a business that is virtuous… that’s not the seafood you’ll get in most supermarkets or restaurants anywhere in the world. [0]: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Outlaw_Ocean https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Outlaw_Ocean