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I don't have much again Thiel's program but US college is only four years. People talk as if that's an eternity. At 22 you're still basically a kid. If you are

I don't have much again Thiel's program but US college is only four years. People talk as if that's an eternity. At 22 you're still basically a kid. If you are a genius of geniuses, you can even speed run college and finish sooner. That said, the article is talking about the big picture and missing all the important details. These Thiel fellows think that Thiel's connections and network, which is basically SV startup scene aristocracy, are worth more than what connections than can gain at a top-10 US college. They probably aren't wrong.

ldjkfkdsjnv 3y ago
I disagree, the energy you have at that age is unparalleled. If you spend it on entrepreneurship, your chances of success are much higher. People consistently underestimate what it takes to build an innovative new company, young very bright people can do it. If they wait til 25/30, they will have lost some of the spark required. It can also take a decade, so start at 25, you are looking at success by 35. Start at 19, by your mid 20s you are in a very good place.
- endisneigh 3y ago
  Nonsense. Go look at this very site’s startups and you will see it’s not true
- jwells89 3y ago
  Early 20s energy is really something else. I can’t even begin to imagine what would be possible if I could somehow send to my 22 year old self my present day 35 year old brain.
  - nothercastle 3y ago
    Energy vs wisdom. Young people like to take 10 actions when only one is needed. Sometimes that works out and other times all those actions are expensive
    - rubymamis 3y ago
      One huge advantage of being young is the unparalleled ability to take risks. There's nothing more anti-fragile (that gains from losses) than a 20-year-old living with his parents.
      - nothercastle 3y ago
        Only if you are born rich with unlimited retry attempts
        rubymamis 3y ago
        Why do you need to be rich to develop software?
        nothercastle 3y ago
        Cause food and housing ain’t free.
- rand1239 3y ago
  > the energy you have at that age is unparalleled. Energy is useless without the skills, knowledge, network, money, economy etc. Look at all the 25 year olds in India who never went to college and is having trouble even making 100$s a month.
- AlexandrB 3y ago
  Energy isn't everything. Having worked for (and known others that worked for) younger founders, the judgement of young founders can be terrible. They're more prone to hype and more likely to panic if something doesn't go as expected. A lot of effort gets wasted on bad decisions.
- insane_dreamer 3y ago
  > if you spend it on entrepreneurship, your chances of success are much higher. as nice as this sounds, considering that vast majority of new businesses fail, I'm not sure that this is true
- neilv 3y ago
  Those darned over-the-hill 25 year-olds! It's about time that they, too, were marginalized by techbro ageism. Take care of your health, and maybe this mystical spark will last longer. Giving you the benefit of increasing knowledge and experience, to direct that energy most usefully (i.e., towards a viable business, not towards a ZIRP/hype VC investment scam powered by the confidence of coked-up 20 year-olds). Avoid drugs, avoid bad stress, get good nutrition, good exercise, good sleep, keep learning.
  - ldjkfkdsjnv 3y ago
    This made me laugh! My point is that there are 18 year olds, rare as they are, that are ready to start companies and navigate that level of complexity.
stainablesteel 3y ago
4 years is super long especially when the first 2 are basically worthless, colleges earn the most money on the first 2 years because it take less resources and are incentivized to get people to drop out within that time frame. plus most people had professions by the time they were 14 before the school system became normal, its actually humiliating and frustrating to not have any real skillset other than filling out worksheets by the time you're 21 plus with the cost being so high, the years feel much worse
- lapcat 3y ago
  > plus most people had professions by the time they were 14 before the school system became normal Serf?
- text0404 3y ago
  > plus most people had professions by the time they were 14 before the school system became normal yeah and we as a society decided that child labor is bad and attempted to craft social conditions that would allow children to be comfortable and to learn instead of toiling in a mine.
  - stainablesteel 3y ago
    not every job was dangerous, child labor in mines showed up in the industrial revolution prior to that children were taught things that genuinely didn't put their life in danger, because they needed to contribute to their family or community's survival
- jmye 3y ago
  > 4 years is super long It really, really isn’t. > its actually humiliating and frustrating to not have any real skillset other than filling out worksheets by the time you're 21 If that’s all you got out of college, it sounds like the problem was not college.
  - stainablesteel 3y ago
    > If that’s all you got out of college, it sounds like the problem was not college. correct, college is a luxury turned bureaucratic requirement, the problem in some peoples life is their family or abuse or trauma. they have every right to want to get out of their situation without waiting 4 years to get something they could rightfully earn in 1 or 2, or even learn on the job
ryandrake 3y ago
I don't really have a strongly held opinion on college vs. not-college anymore, but... > At 22 you're still basically a kid. 22 is not a kid. 22 is a grown ass adult, and there are a lot of people who have their shit together long before that. We seem to keep trying to push up the age when a person gains the ability to make their own decisions and be responsible for their own actions. People were leading armies at that age not very long ago. Back on topic: I'll just add that earnings-wise, due to compound interest, money saved earlier in one's career is worth far more than money saved later. "Sitting out" for your prime four earning years is only worth it if the education would provide a similar or greater boost.
- lapcat 3y ago
  > We seem to keep trying to push up the age when a person gains the ability to make their own decisions and be responsible for their own actions. No, we seem to keep trying to push down the age when a person loses the ability to acquire further education. Thiel himself got not just one but two degrees from Stanford. Are you going to criticize him for not having his shit together? Let's be honest, he's opposing college now purely for ideological reasons. > People were leading armies at that age not very long ago. Ok, but have you considered that war is actually bad?
  - pg_1234 3y ago
    > Thiel himself got not just one but two degrees from Stanford.... > ... > ... he's opposing college now purely for ideological reasons. But maybe his ideological criticisms are valid. And maybe the college environment has changed since he was there. And maybe the value proposition for a talented person has shifted. And maybe the mere presence of offers like Thiel's also increases the acceptability and therefore the "signalling" value proposition of a first year drop-out strategy.
    - lapcat 3y ago
      > But maybe his ideological criticisms are valid. No. > And maybe the value proposition for a talented person has shifted. That much is true, since college costs have increased dramatically since Thiel attended. If he cared about that, maybe he should offer to pay for people's student loan debt or finance some scholarships. Or promote government-paid higher education for all, like with pre-college education.

ldjkfkdsjnv 3y ago

I disagree, the energy you have at that age is unparalleled. If you spend it on entrepreneurship, your chances of success are much higher. People consistently underestimate what it takes to build an innovative new company, young very bright people can do it. If they wait til 25/30, they will have lost some of the spark required. It can also take a decade, so start at 25, you are looking at success by 35. Start at 19, by your mid 20s you are in a very good place.

endisneigh 3y ago
Nonsense. Go look at this very site’s startups and you will see it’s not true
jwells89 3y ago
Early 20s energy is really something else. I can’t even begin to imagine what would be possible if I could somehow send to my 22 year old self my present day 35 year old brain.
- nothercastle 3y ago
  Energy vs wisdom. Young people like to take 10 actions when only one is needed. Sometimes that works out and other times all those actions are expensive
  - rubymamis 3y ago
    One huge advantage of being young is the unparalleled ability to take risks. There's nothing more anti-fragile (that gains from losses) than a 20-year-old living with his parents.
    - nothercastle 3y ago
      Only if you are born rich with unlimited retry attempts
      - rubymamis 3y ago
        Why do you need to be rich to develop software?
        nothercastle 3y ago
        Cause food and housing ain’t free.
rand1239 3y ago
> the energy you have at that age is unparalleled. Energy is useless without the skills, knowledge, network, money, economy etc. Look at all the 25 year olds in India who never went to college and is having trouble even making 100$s a month.
AlexandrB 3y ago
Energy isn't everything. Having worked for (and known others that worked for) younger founders, the judgement of young founders can be terrible. They're more prone to hype and more likely to panic if something doesn't go as expected. A lot of effort gets wasted on bad decisions.
insane_dreamer 3y ago
> if you spend it on entrepreneurship, your chances of success are much higher. as nice as this sounds, considering that vast majority of new businesses fail, I'm not sure that this is true
neilv 3y ago
Those darned over-the-hill 25 year-olds! It's about time that they, too, were marginalized by techbro ageism. Take care of your health, and maybe this mystical spark will last longer. Giving you the benefit of increasing knowledge and experience, to direct that energy most usefully (i.e., towards a viable business, not towards a ZIRP/hype VC investment scam powered by the confidence of coked-up 20 year-olds). Avoid drugs, avoid bad stress, get good nutrition, good exercise, good sleep, keep learning.
- ldjkfkdsjnv 3y ago
  This made me laugh! My point is that there are 18 year olds, rare as they are, that are ready to start companies and navigate that level of complexity.

stainablesteel 3y ago

4 years is super long especially when the first 2 are basically worthless, colleges earn the most money on the first 2 years because it take less resources and are incentivized to get people to drop out within that time frame. plus most people had professions by the time they were 14 before the school system became normal, its actually humiliating and frustrating to not have any real skillset other than filling out worksheets by the time you're 21 plus with the cost being so high, the years feel much worse

lapcat 3y ago
> plus most people had professions by the time they were 14 before the school system became normal Serf?
text0404 3y ago
> plus most people had professions by the time they were 14 before the school system became normal yeah and we as a society decided that child labor is bad and attempted to craft social conditions that would allow children to be comfortable and to learn instead of toiling in a mine.
- stainablesteel 3y ago
  not every job was dangerous, child labor in mines showed up in the industrial revolution prior to that children were taught things that genuinely didn't put their life in danger, because they needed to contribute to their family or community's survival
jmye 3y ago
> 4 years is super long It really, really isn’t. > its actually humiliating and frustrating to not have any real skillset other than filling out worksheets by the time you're 21 If that’s all you got out of college, it sounds like the problem was not college.
- stainablesteel 3y ago
  > If that’s all you got out of college, it sounds like the problem was not college. correct, college is a luxury turned bureaucratic requirement, the problem in some peoples life is their family or abuse or trauma. they have every right to want to get out of their situation without waiting 4 years to get something they could rightfully earn in 1 or 2, or even learn on the job

ryandrake 3y ago

I don't really have a strongly held opinion on college vs. not-college anymore, but... > At 22 you're still basically a kid. 22 is not a kid. 22 is a grown ass adult, and there are a lot of people who have their shit together long before that. We seem to keep trying to push up the age when a person gains the ability to make their own decisions and be responsible for their own actions. People were leading armies at that age not very long ago. Back on topic: I'll just add that earnings-wise, due to compound interest, money saved earlier in one's career is worth far more than money saved later. "Sitting out" for your prime four earning years is only worth it if the education would provide a similar or greater boost.

lapcat 3y ago
> We seem to keep trying to push up the age when a person gains the ability to make their own decisions and be responsible for their own actions. No, we seem to keep trying to push down the age when a person loses the ability to acquire further education. Thiel himself got not just one but two degrees from Stanford. Are you going to criticize him for not having his shit together? Let's be honest, he's opposing college now purely for ideological reasons. > People were leading armies at that age not very long ago. Ok, but have you considered that war is actually bad?
- pg_1234 3y ago
  > Thiel himself got not just one but two degrees from Stanford.... > ... > ... he's opposing college now purely for ideological reasons. But maybe his ideological criticisms are valid. And maybe the college environment has changed since he was there. And maybe the value proposition for a talented person has shifted. And maybe the mere presence of offers like Thiel's also increases the acceptability and therefore the "signalling" value proposition of a first year drop-out strategy.
  - lapcat 3y ago
    > But maybe his ideological criticisms are valid. No. > And maybe the value proposition for a talented person has shifted. That much is true, since college costs have increased dramatically since Thiel attended. If he cared about that, maybe he should offer to pay for people's student loan debt or finance some scholarships. Or promote government-paid higher education for all, like with pre-college education.