4 ms·

These types of projects always remind me of MS Access. Access is forms on a database, and really easy to use. It obviously has its drawbacks but nothing has com

These types of projects always remind me of MS Access. Access is forms on a database, and really easy to use. It obviously has its drawbacks but nothing has come close to it. I've never understood why MS didn't capitalise on it by extending and improving it.

CGamesPlay 3y ago
Because the single-system paradigm doesn't work any more. However, modern replacements do exist, Airtable is one of the first; it's basically the notion of a "spreadsheet with more structure", and then building forms and such on top of that. I've recently been playing with Grist and like it, although it is rough around the edges. https://www.getgrist.com https://www.getgrist.com
- keybits 3y ago
  I love Grist, and relevant to this discussion, it now has forms: https://www.getgrist.com/forms/ https://www.getgrist.com/forms/ Grist is open source, Python scriptable and each project is stored in a SQLite database.
- datadrivenangel 3y ago
  Airtable also has a surprisingly small hard row limit. 50k rows is very easy to hit quickly.
  - breadwinner 3y ago
    If you want Airtable, but with unlimited rows in the DB, that's Visual DB: https://visualdb.com https://visualdb.com You can use query parameters to specify which subset of records to bring to the frontend.
TheFragenTaken 3y ago
I'd love a modern non-SaaS MS Access equivalent, that just use files: https://stephango.com/file-over-app https://stephango.com/file-over-app
codeulike 3y ago
I never saw an Access database that didn't become a regretful mess after a couple of years - the person that made it left, no-one knew how to update it. Fancy validation built into the form that just got in the way when requirements changed. Thus I came to the conclusion that any Access database is probably better off being a spreadsheet, even with all the chaos that not having forms as a front end and not having relational structure entails. At least people can understand other peoples spreadsheets (up to a point)
- EvanAnderson 3y ago
  Most Access-based apps turn to shit because they're made by non-developers. The tool itself isn't to blame. I've seen Access used to great success when coupled with scripting to dump schema and code to text files for version control and code review.
  - codeulike 3y ago
    Right, but if you're a developer you might as well use something more developery. Like the selling point of Access was supposed to be that non-coders could use it to knock together a database. In the late 90s I built some quite big things in Access and promptly regretted it. I guess Access got used for those projects because the organisation already 'owned' it as part of the Office bundle whereas Visual Studio 6 was seen as 'expensive' (I think it was about £500 per developer or something). But these days that problem would not occur. The days of development tools needing comparatively expensive licences are over.
    - EvanAnderson 3y ago
      > I guess Access got used for those projects because the organisation already 'owned' it... > The days of development tools needing comparatively expensive licences are over. That's exactly the motivation I saw for Access being used in the past. I agree, those days are over and that justification for using Access is moot.
- account-5 3y ago
prakashn27 3y ago
I miss acccess too. Good old days
- breadwinner 3y ago
  It is still available.
akvadrako 3y ago
I don't know, it's something I've wanted many times. Recently I discovered https://directus.io/ https://directus.io/ which comes pretty close and it's open source.

CGamesPlay 3y ago

Because the single-system paradigm doesn't work any more. However, modern replacements do exist, Airtable is one of the first; it's basically the notion of a "spreadsheet with more structure", and then building forms and such on top of that. I've recently been playing with Grist and like it, although it is rough around the edges. https://www.getgrist.com https://www.getgrist.com

keybits 3y ago
I love Grist, and relevant to this discussion, it now has forms: https://www.getgrist.com/forms/ https://www.getgrist.com/forms/ Grist is open source, Python scriptable and each project is stored in a SQLite database.
datadrivenangel 3y ago
Airtable also has a surprisingly small hard row limit. 50k rows is very easy to hit quickly.
- breadwinner 3y ago
  If you want Airtable, but with unlimited rows in the DB, that's Visual DB: https://visualdb.com https://visualdb.com You can use query parameters to specify which subset of records to bring to the frontend.

TheFragenTaken 3y ago

I'd love a modern non-SaaS MS Access equivalent, that just use files: https://stephango.com/file-over-app https://stephango.com/file-over-app

codeulike 3y ago

I never saw an Access database that didn't become a regretful mess after a couple of years - the person that made it left, no-one knew how to update it. Fancy validation built into the form that just got in the way when requirements changed. Thus I came to the conclusion that any Access database is probably better off being a spreadsheet, even with all the chaos that not having forms as a front end and not having relational structure entails. At least people can understand other peoples spreadsheets (up to a point)

EvanAnderson 3y ago
Most Access-based apps turn to shit because they're made by non-developers. The tool itself isn't to blame. I've seen Access used to great success when coupled with scripting to dump schema and code to text files for version control and code review.
- codeulike 3y ago
  Right, but if you're a developer you might as well use something more developery. Like the selling point of Access was supposed to be that non-coders could use it to knock together a database. In the late 90s I built some quite big things in Access and promptly regretted it. I guess Access got used for those projects because the organisation already 'owned' it as part of the Office bundle whereas Visual Studio 6 was seen as 'expensive' (I think it was about £500 per developer or something). But these days that problem would not occur. The days of development tools needing comparatively expensive licences are over.
  - EvanAnderson 3y ago
    > I guess Access got used for those projects because the organisation already 'owned' it... > The days of development tools needing comparatively expensive licences are over. That's exactly the motivation I saw for Access being used in the past. I agree, those days are over and that justification for using Access is moot.
account-5 3y ago

prakashn27 3y ago

I miss acccess too. Good old days

breadwinner 3y ago
It is still available.

akvadrako 3y ago

I don't know, it's something I've wanted many times. Recently I discovered https://directus.io/ https://directus.io/ which comes pretty close and it's open source.