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Show HN: Supermaven, the first code completion tool with 300k token context
- falleng0d 3y agoImpressed by the completion speed. It really changes everything... again. Do you have plans to add a chat feature and IntelliJ plugin?
- jacob-jackson 3y agoGlad to hear it. We'll add an IntelliJ plugin next week. We may add a chat feature if we can make one good enough that we're happy with the quality.
- hboon 3y agoNeovim? :)
- sagarpatil 3y agoA chat plugin for VS Code will be a game changer.
- daemonologist 3y agoAgreed - I've only been using it for a few minutes so can't form a definitive opinion on quality (though it seems good) but it feels faster than intellisense. Extremely impressive on that front.
- maxchehab 3y agoI've been using Supermaven for the past week and it's obviously better than copilot. Excited to see this product evolve!
- edent 3y agoWhose code is it trained on? Do you respect their software licences?
- CrimsonRain 3y agonext you'll say I need a license to read your comment because I'm copying it in my mind. Crazy!
- altruios 3y agoAsking what the training data was, is valid. Knowing what these AI are trained on is to everyone's benefit.
- CrimsonRain 3y agoYour comment is correct but misdirected. I didn't say anything about OP's first question. Your comment is about that.
- rrrix1 3y agoAs a contrived example... If you train exclusively on AGPL source code, the probability of generating something identical to AGPL licensed code is likely non-zero. This is a very important question.
- leereeves 3y agoAn LLM is not the same thing as a human mind and does not automatically receive the same exception to copyrights. Whatever you think makes sense, it would be wise to be careful, because the law might not turn out to be what you want it to be.
- tbrownaw 3y agoWhat exception?
- leereeves 3y agoPerhaps it's overly technical or even pedantic, but in light of arguments like "AI is just doing the same thing humans do", I think we should admit it: Yes, we are making a copy in our minds when we read something. I suspect such copies are allowed (as an exception to copyright law) mostly because lawyers and judges don't think about it. Nonetheless, once we do think about it, the law isn't required to treat humans and LLMs in the same way, or allow LLMs to do something simply because humans are allowed to do something similar.
- i_am_proteus 3y ago>At Supermaven we've developed and trained from scratch a new neural network architecture which is more efficient than a Transformer (the current standard architecture) at integrating information across a long context window. Clearly something proprietary, but in between this and Gemini's claimed 10M tokens, assuming there's no RAG... I'm curious what might be happening behind the scenes.
- htrp 3y agorope or ringattention?
- twobitshifter 3y agoThere’s a few options. People think Gemini 1.5 is Sparse Mixture of Experts. (SMoE) Another One is self extend. https://arxiv.org/abs/2401.01325 https://arxiv.org/abs/2401.01325 This paper also refers back to other options like yarn, etc.
- _boffin_ 3y agoMamba?
- gardnr 3y agodefinitely sounds like an ssm.
- Nevin1901 3y agoInteresting launch. I saw you were the original founder of tabnine. I’m curious as to what you’ve learned since you launched tabnine in 2018, and why you’re deciding to create another code completion ide extension. Will be trying this out.
- jacob-jackson 3y agoI had the idea for the technology first and decided that code completion was the application where it would be the most useful. It's a proven market with Copilot having over $100M ARR. There are lots of other potential use cases for the technology, but they involve more business risk (ie, the risk that you create a technically sound product that isn't very useful).
- pr337h4m 3y agoOff topic, but do you have any plans for same.energy? No image search tool has surpassed it even after two years.
- jacob-jackson 3y agoI'm happy to hear that. I don't have any specific plans for same.energy at the moment other than to keep the site up.
- vlovich123 3y agoDoes this involve uploading the git project to Supermaven and code completions are done in the cloud or is all this running locally? Or is it hybrid where there’s some cloud processing and inference happens locally?
- jacob-jackson 3y agoAll the processing happens in the cloud. It will upload the git repository you use it on. We retain the data for a maximum of 7 days.
- a2128 3y agoYour privacy policy[0] doesn't seem to mention any of this. How is the data being used? I'm not very certain about inputting my data into any tool that uploads to cloud and there's no valid privacy policy [0] https://supermaven.com/privacy-policy https://supermaven.com/privacy-policy
- jacob-jackson 3y agoWe should update the site to be clearer about this. There is a 7-day data retention limit listed in https://supermaven.com/pricing https://supermaven.com/pricing.
- codetrotter 3y agoDo you train and/or refine your models based on customer source code?
- _andrei_ 3y agoPlease clarify what the data is used for.
- sickcodebruh 3y agoThis is the main thing keeping me from trying it. If you could clarify how you protect and use our code, it would be a huge help.
- spdustin 3y ago- No details at all on the official extension page in VSCode - I bite the bullet and try anyway - No immediate confirmation after setup - Only one configuration option (log file path) - After I start typing into a buffer, the onboarding notification requires sign-in - Sure, why not - "Link to IDE?" - heck yeah, let's finally go - Sign up for a trial - um... - Requires a CC for a 30-day free trial Respectfully, this is a terrible experience.
- jacob-jackson 3y agoSorry. We should be more clear about the CC being required to sign up for the free trial.
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]
- vmurthy 3y agoI can understand the business imperatives (I am a PM at a start-up :)), but can you please make a decision on actually having the sign up flow work without friction (Think Slack / dropbox etc). You can always iterate and find the right thing to charge for but developers are a demanding bunch especially with tooling!
- reaperman 3y agoThis goes against the guidelines for "Show HN". You can still post it, but generally it won't qualify for the Show HN moniker. You can review the rules for Show HN here: https://news.ycombinator.com/showhn.html https://news.ycombinator.com/showhn.html > Please make it easy for users to try your thing out, ideally without barriers such as signups or emails. "Without signups or emails" definitely implies without credit card authorization!
- jacob-jackson 3y agoI didn't realize that. I would have posted without the Show HN tag if I had read that carefully.
- avidphantasm 3y agoIf you don’t like writing code, find a different line of work.
- mostlysimilar 3y agoI really must be missing something with all of these tools writing code for you. Shipping my entire codebase off to some unknown party does not seem like a worthwhile tradeoff for not having to write my own indentation function or whatever.
- falleng0d 3y agoYou are really missing it. It's more about preventing RSI by getting the boilerplate writing out of the way than having the tool do the actual work for you.
- avidphantasm 3y agoIf you are writing boilerplate all the time, it’s time to introduce some abstractions and put them in a library.
- huytersd 3y agoIt’s a matter of speed and delivery.
- rglover 3y agoSpeed and delivery of what, though? The religion of speed is blinding people to (what I thought was) the obvious trap of these tools: encouraging the incorporation of code the author likely doesn't understand into complex systems and just "trusting the robot is right." For an experienced developer this may be about productivity, but 100M ARR at Copilot tells me we've got novices yeeting whatever code the LLM gives them into their work. So, you get two problems: systems with questionable integrity and a future generation of "engineers" who lack practical knowledge that can only be earned by solving problems.
- janice1999 3y agoHow do you guarantee you will not add GPL or similarly licensed code to my proprietary codebase? Microsoft committed to defending its customers from claims arising from CoPilot output [0]. Would you be confident enough to do likewise? [0] https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/licensing/news/Microsoft-Copilot-Copyright-Commitment https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/licensing/news/Microsoft-Cop...
- madeofpalk 3y agoGitHub Copilot also automatically flags generated code that’s too similar to existing code out there.
- oneshtein 3y agoObfuscation tools does that too. It doesn't changes the fact that generated code is based on other people copyrighted code. M$ doesn't use their own code in the training of ChatGPT, but steals other people copyrighted work instead.
- aussieguy1234 3y ago>While a model like GPT-4 offers unmatched suggestion quality, it's impossible to run on every keystroke (unless you charge users $1,000/month) Still alot less than the average SWE salary and this cost will go down over time. Anyway, jokes aside, I usually don't use copilot tools in my IDEs. I have zero difficulty with coding itself. I would not enable one unless i'm trying to learn a new language or something. I can see how they would be helpful for more junior level engineers, but they'd still need someone senior to check for security vulnerabilities and the like. Where LLMs come in handy is more complicated scenarios like understanding legacy spaghetti code, learning a new API without having to read the documentation, finding out how do to X in a new framework, undocumented behaviours and as a solo founder, non code tasks like marketing copy, mock customer interviews, writing data science type SQL queries to better understand my metrics, naming my subscription plans etc which I otherwise would not be that great at. For these tasks I always use GPT-4 which almost always gets good results. But its nowhere near the level where it could replace an actual engineer, even if you fed it an entire codebase.
- spoiler 3y ago> I can see how they would be helpful for more junior level engineers Honestly, I'm a senior dev and enjoy the copilot stuff. It gets shit wrong most times it needs to do something beyond simple-ish, but for doing boilerplate or repetitive stuff, it's been great!
- p1necone 3y ago> I can see how they would be helpful for more junior level engineers I'd argue the opposite - give something like chatgpt/copilot to a junior engineer and they use it to generate a bunch of overly repetitive code that they don't understand. If they're trying to write anything even slightly non trivial it's not going to work. In order to get value from AI code generation you need to be competent enough to properly review the output.
- thelastparadise 3y ago> In order to get value from AI code generation you need to be competent enough to properly review the output. And to know what to ask.
- chenxi9649 3y agoExcited to see this on HN front page! Unlike others, I didn't mind the CC + 30 day trial. 30 days actually feels generously long as I don't see many other projects offering that. I think it's ultimately right move for this project to live long. After trying it for a bit on a very very large codebase(more than the context window supported, albeit I haven't done anything superr insightful yet), the code suggestion does seem better + faster than Copilot. However, I'm not sure if the "completion" UX is the best way to enhance human programmers with AI. And within the completion realm, leaning on the speed, ie. inferencing on every keystroke, is not that attractive for myself. What attracted me is really the context length. So I'd provide much more examples of cross context code suggestion, similar to the 3js demo from gemini 1.5. Back to the completion UX thing. I feel like often times seeing the completion pop up is a double edged sword. The moment it pops up, it distracts me from "outputting mode" into "evaluation mode" to see if the result is correct. If it's right, then great, you've saved me time. But for the times where it's wrong(which... was quite a bit for copilot), it's actually a net negative as I now have to re-enter the "outputting mode" and force myself to ignore the new output that will get generated as the new keystroke comes out. With Supermaven, this "switch" happens 10x more than copilot because of the speed as well. Cursor/Zed with their CMD K code insert is obviously the other "big" ai coding UX.(along with chat) Personally I like them quite a bit and wish they had the speed and context window that supermaven is currently offering. But tbh, all of the UX's feel a little off at the moment... Just my 2c' as an amateur programmer!
- oniony 3y agoAbsolutely. I turned off Copilot at work for this reason: it disrupts my state of flow in a way that regular contextual suggestions do not.
- kibbi 3y agoWhich programming languages is Supermaven good at?
- csomar 3y agoAny plans for a Neovim plugin? Quite interested but don't feel like switching to VSCode any time soon.
- unshavedyak 3y agoYea, we need an LSP-like spec or something here. I'm on Helix, and like you i just can't switch away for these things. I wonder if the LSP spec itself should add some LLM extensions. Since i know some projects have already just made LLM-LSP impls, it's not far off from a normal LSP. Though i do imagine a few custom LLM-centric behaviors would be useful
- zokier 3y agoI'm not ML practitioner, so idk, but could we get generative tool that operates on higher syntatic level (e.g. AST) instead of interpreting code as just plain text? I feel it's so dumb that something like copilot generates code that is syntatically invalid, that feels like low bar for any code generation tool to pass?
- isaacfung 3y agoThese may be useful https://github.com/ggerganov/llama.cpp/blob/master/grammars https://github.com/ggerganov/llama.cpp/blob/master/grammars https://github.com/guidance-ai/guidance?tab=readme-ov-file#context-free-grammars https://github.com/guidance-ai/guidance?tab=readme-ov-file#c... https://github.com/eth-sri/lmql/issues/172 https://github.com/eth-sri/lmql/issues/172
- holoduke 3y ago> "it's impossible to run on every keystroke" Maybe not every keystroke, but certainly every time I press enter or shift. It feels like its live and instant. Dont think that a higher frequency makes sense.
- notmyrealnam3 3y ago[flagged]
- cbeach 3y ago#MuskDerangementSyndrome strikes again. How about we focus on the tech rather than signalling our tribal political affiliation at every opportunity?
- solumunus 3y agoI signed up for the free trial and downloaded the extension. All I'm getting is a blank command prompt window "sm-agent.exe" that opens when I open VS code. So yeh, it's just not working for me at all. Tried opening VS Code as admin and no difference. Any suggestions?
- jacob-jackson 3y agoSorry to hear that. I'm not sure what's causing this. Could you share your Windows and VS Code version to help us reproduce the issue? sm-agent.exe is supposed to be started as a subprocess by the extension. It shouldn't be in its own window.
- jimjim45 3y agoIts a virus! virus total said 2 detection Ikarus Trojan.OSX.Psw and Google Detected
- jimjim45 3y agohttps://www.virustotal.com/gui/file/35d9dbe227f03b439b5f426427e19f03d569b5464721e36dc594cd6042a00ed2?nocache=1 https://www.virustotal.com/gui/file/35d9dbe227f03b439b5f4264...
- TriangleEdge 3y agoI'd like to see <super-long-context> vs <mediocre-context-but-really-good-at-summarizing>, then it is fed parts of a super long context in chunks. On each iteration, you add the previous summary.
- Syzygies 3y agoDoes this only work with "mainstream" languages? Swift, perhaps. Chez Scheme? Haskell? Lean 4?
- yewenjie 3y agoWith the 300k context window, the first thing I want to do is refactor my entire codebase, not just code completion here and there.
- omnibrain 3y agoBut WHO is Supermaven? Who do I "entrust" with all of my code?
- oddevan 3y agoTrying it now on my super-specific codebase, and it seems to be working for the most part. Well done! I was able to get started on a new feature, and it got about 80% there with my custom-built framework: https://github.com/smolblog/smolblog/pull/61/commits/869a2ea262a571cf764af1dfcdeaf33c70ac65c2 https://github.com/smolblog/smolblog/pull/61/commits/869a2ea...
- theflyinghorse 3y agoHave been using supermaven for about 5 days on a react project. It is way faster than copilot, suggestions generally feel better as well, less hallucinated. For instance, if I change a type in a src/bookingTypes.ts, then supermaven has no issues guessing that those updated types should be recommended in src/components/bookingform/Bookingform.tsx . Copilot sometimes struggles with this recommending it's own, hallucinated types
- gofreddygo 3y agoMaybe its just me, but the name suggested an AI based tool to generate maven pom.xml files. The pain I've experienced with maven and those Gawd awful xmls got me a bit too excited. going to crawl back to my burrow now.
- anotheryou 3y agoAny chance to have an edit-prompt like cursor instead of autocomplete?