3 ms·

We should come up with some kind of democratic voting system where every HN user can help decide what does and doesn’t have anything to do with HN.

shiroiushi 3y ago
Democratic systems don't get the results existing members want when a bunch of new members are allowed into the system and vote against them. As a thought exercise, imagine some small, liberal, European nation with 10M people suddenly had 20M ultra-conservative Muslims move in, and vote. The laws would change drastically at that point, and the previous citizens probably wouldn't like it very much. I don't know the stats, but if tons of mainland Chinese users are joining HN and voting on stories, and making pro-China comments, then of course this is going to have a big effect on things, and longtime non-Chinese users probably won't like it. I don't really see a solution to this; HN could simply ban traffic from mainland China, but I doubt they'd do that because it's against the whole "freedom" ethos. But if it gets too flooded with China stuff (esp. if it's pro-CCP propaganda), then people will simply leave. Overall, I see this as a big vulnerability in democracy. If you're not careful who you give voting power too, you can get outcomes you really don't like, especially if you give voting power to people who are actively opposed to your existing voter base. It's even worse on the internet where people can write bots to create fake accounts.
- resolutebat 3y ago
  Where are you seeing pro-China comments? HN tends rabidly anti-China, and this very article's comments are full of the usual talking points: the price must be low because of state subsidies, because it's unsafe, because it's unreliable, because the build quality is terrible, etc.
  - shiroiushi 3y ago
    I see them pretty frequently here. They usually get countered by anti-China-propaganda comments, but not always. I think they're slowly becoming more numerous.

shiroiushi 3y ago

Democratic systems don't get the results existing members want when a bunch of new members are allowed into the system and vote against them. As a thought exercise, imagine some small, liberal, European nation with 10M people suddenly had 20M ultra-conservative Muslims move in, and vote. The laws would change drastically at that point, and the previous citizens probably wouldn't like it very much. I don't know the stats, but if tons of mainland Chinese users are joining HN and voting on stories, and making pro-China comments, then of course this is going to have a big effect on things, and longtime non-Chinese users probably won't like it. I don't really see a solution to this; HN could simply ban traffic from mainland China, but I doubt they'd do that because it's against the whole "freedom" ethos. But if it gets too flooded with China stuff (esp. if it's pro-CCP propaganda), then people will simply leave. Overall, I see this as a big vulnerability in democracy. If you're not careful who you give voting power too, you can get outcomes you really don't like, especially if you give voting power to people who are actively opposed to your existing voter base. It's even worse on the internet where people can write bots to create fake accounts.

resolutebat 3y ago
Where are you seeing pro-China comments? HN tends rabidly anti-China, and this very article's comments are full of the usual talking points: the price must be low because of state subsidies, because it's unsafe, because it's unreliable, because the build quality is terrible, etc.
- shiroiushi 3y ago
  I see them pretty frequently here. They usually get countered by anti-China-propaganda comments, but not always. I think they're slowly becoming more numerous.