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In the context of this article (Canada focused), do the relevant Hyundais and Kias have the same security problem? https://www.ctvnews.ca/autos/kia-and-hyundai

In the context of this article (Canada focused), do the relevant Hyundais and Kias have the same security problem? https://www.ctvnews.ca/autos/kia-and-hyundai-vehicles-in-canada-not-affected-by-u-s-theft-issue-automakers-say-1.6252590 https://www.ctvnews.ca/autos/kia-and-hyundai-vehicles-in-can...

ceejayoz 3y ago
I agree with the article; that regulating car manufacturers who make insecure cars is the correct approach. This specific case illustrates the effectiveness of the approach.
- sokoloff 3y ago
  (I agree with the article as well.)
- jonhohle 3y ago
  I read this view as: it’s fine to steal a car without an immobilizer. That’s an insane take (and why we can’t have nice things). Meanwhile other modern countries (albeit with much stricter law enforcement and a more unified value system) can operate with 0.1% of the equivalent crime and that’s not what we aspire to. Instead we want to blame the manufacturer who must have certainly enticed antisocial, destructive behavior. What an awful and poisonous worldview.
  - sokoloff 3y ago
    It's worth noting that Hyundai and Kia actually ship different anti-theft technology in some of these other modern countries, because regulations in those other modern countries require it. The fact that the US doesn't require it (this article is about Canada, but other subthreads are talking about those manufacturers specifically). It seems entirely reasonable to take the article's point of view which is "don't ban FlipperZero just because it can be used to facilitate car theft [among 1000 other uses], but rather regulate cars so that they become harder to steal". Further, I realize you didn't put a ton of thought into the specific 0.1% figure, but I seriously doubt that other modern countries are 1000x better on equivalent crime measures than either the US or Canada. Even New Zealand, with quite strict gun laws, has a firearm death rate that is a little over 1/12th that of the US's: https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/gun-deaths-by-country https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/gun-death...
  - ceejayoz 3y ago
    > I read this view as: it’s fine to steal a car without an immobilizer. No. Car manufacturers should still take reasonable steps to prevent it. To make an analogy, people should not steal from banks... but it would still be negligent to leave the bank unlocked at night.

ceejayoz 3y ago

I agree with the article; that regulating car manufacturers who make insecure cars is the correct approach. This specific case illustrates the effectiveness of the approach.

sokoloff 3y ago
(I agree with the article as well.)
jonhohle 3y ago
I read this view as: it’s fine to steal a car without an immobilizer. That’s an insane take (and why we can’t have nice things). Meanwhile other modern countries (albeit with much stricter law enforcement and a more unified value system) can operate with 0.1% of the equivalent crime and that’s not what we aspire to. Instead we want to blame the manufacturer who must have certainly enticed antisocial, destructive behavior. What an awful and poisonous worldview.
- sokoloff 3y ago
  It's worth noting that Hyundai and Kia actually ship different anti-theft technology in some of these other modern countries, because regulations in those other modern countries require it. The fact that the US doesn't require it (this article is about Canada, but other subthreads are talking about those manufacturers specifically). It seems entirely reasonable to take the article's point of view which is "don't ban FlipperZero just because it can be used to facilitate car theft [among 1000 other uses], but rather regulate cars so that they become harder to steal". Further, I realize you didn't put a ton of thought into the specific 0.1% figure, but I seriously doubt that other modern countries are 1000x better on equivalent crime measures than either the US or Canada. Even New Zealand, with quite strict gun laws, has a firearm death rate that is a little over 1/12th that of the US's: https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/gun-deaths-by-country https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/gun-death...
- ceejayoz 3y ago
  > I read this view as: it’s fine to steal a car without an immobilizer. No. Car manufacturers should still take reasonable steps to prevent it. To make an analogy, people should not steal from banks... but it would still be negligent to leave the bank unlocked at night.