5 ms·

Argentina has been like this for a very long time. I studied abroad there in 2019 and it was exactly the same. I believe one of the reasons Brian Armstrong star

Argentina has been like this for a very long time. I studied abroad there in 2019 and it was exactly the same. I believe one of the reasons Brian Armstrong started Coinbase was because he saw how devastating inflation was to Argentina’s economy. Argentina was at one point a top 20 country in the world wealth wise and has obviously gone very down hill. It’s too bad, a lot of talented tech workers there.

onlyrealcuzzo 3y ago
Argentina didn't really go down hill. Constant GDP per capita is up ~50% from 1960: https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/NYGDPPCAPKDARG https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/NYGDPPCAPKDARG The GDP of the rest of the world went up a lot more than that [1] - and Argentina never did anything besides have decent weather and a roughly constant amount of fertile land. It's kind of like a Dutch Disease: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dutch_disease https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dutch_disease [1] https://fred.stlouisfed.org/graph/?g=eMGt https://fred.stlouisfed.org/graph/?g=eMGt
- thriftwy 3y ago
  People didn't really need smartphones, laptops and even personal cars in 1960s in Argentine. I believe they generated that GDP while being mostly rural, where it translates to a lot of amenities. Now they would usually be cramped in a city where the effective cost of living is much greater (leading to villas), whereas their GDP and thus income didn't grow much.
  - Wytwwww 3y ago
    70-80%+ of the population was already living in urban areas in the 60s though.
    - thriftwy 3y ago
      Perhaps we've spotted a case for sloggy Argentinean growth, since the country doesn't strike me as being an industrial giant or a R&D hub - what would they all do living in urban areas?
      - MichaelZuo 3y ago
        A huge portion of the population in the cities doesn't do anything, quite literally living on the government budget. Hence why the poverty rate near instantly skyrocketed after the huge cuts to government spending recently.
      - pjc50 3y ago
        ?? Urban areas are just the default for the 20th century, let alone the 21st. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economy_of_Argentina https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economy_of_Argentina is surprisingly comprehensive. The sidebar has agriculture at 7% of the economy. The place is not without industry, it's just making and selling things at ""wrong"" prices because of the currency issue, which in turn comes from the balance of payments issue. There's clearly substantial local commerce, just not quite enough export.
        thriftwy 3y ago
        What % of exports, though, and what % of exports to the countries outside of the region (i.e. the globally competitive industries)? Even by world standards, 70-80% of urbanization in the 60s and 92% now is quite a lot. Especially a lot for a country which mostly exports agricultural produce. Without checking, I would expect it to be 50% in the 60s and 70-80% today.
epolanski 3y ago
Inflation is a symptom, not the cause. Not sure how Argentinians are supposed to do better using cryptocurrencies.
- froblesmartin 3y ago
  Well, at least you can save and not be in the need to spend your money soon, as it then devalues quickly, which helps to stop inflation :D They could just search € or USD, which they do :D But the government used to have a cap of 200$ per person and month to exchange (not sure if that still happens now with Milei)
  - Wytwwww 3y ago
    On the whole income be significantly lower because the state couldn't afford to pay them as much (or at all) anymore.
  - pjc50 3y ago
    The inflation is still a symptom of the balance of payments problem. What cryptocurrency lets you do is evade the capital controls and get closer to dollar-referenced currency.
- GaryNumanVevo 3y ago
  They'd be better off holding literally any _other_ currency. US dollars are hard to get in large quantities, and you'd be stuck holding a lot of cash. Bitcoin (or any crypto currency, BTC isn't unique here) is just easier to buy and hold as a hedge against inflation
  - thriftwy 3y ago
    I've never seen issues with obtaining any required quantity of physical US dollars cash, and that includes 2022 Russia.
- 7thaccount 3y ago
  There is no federal agency or corporation that can inflate Bitcoin like Argentina's central bank has been doing. This is the major cause of inflation.
yard2010 3y ago
Been there in 2014 with a group of friends. We ran out of cash. I took the ferry to Uruguay with 4 credit cards and for a day each 2 hours draw the max sum the ATM let me. Returned with 4k dollars in my pockets. Not before I bought something to smoke and smoked a big doobie on the beach in the sunset. God, I miss this muchileros life.
braza 3y ago
2 small pieces of anecdotes 1) I used to work in a very large IT group in Latin America, and I worked with some EngManagers who hired and managed some folks in Argentina. One interesting dynamic was due to the inflation, we used to give to folks 'monthly' salary increases to offset. Since the company captured the inflation also in the prices, for a long time offer that offset with a small plus was a very huge retention factor for us; 2) After 2015/6, our IT director started to give 1 Bitcoin or USD 500 equivalent in Bitcoin for our argentine colleagues as part of their monthly salary, and eventually those guys ended up holding or selling it with more than 10x over it.
sergiotapia 3y ago
The Crystal language was written by gauchos!
- cassianoleal 3y ago
  So was Godot, the open source gaming engine.

onlyrealcuzzo 3y ago

Argentina didn't really go down hill. Constant GDP per capita is up ~50% from 1960: https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/NYGDPPCAPKDARG https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/NYGDPPCAPKDARG The GDP of the rest of the world went up a lot more than that [1] - and Argentina never did anything besides have decent weather and a roughly constant amount of fertile land. It's kind of like a Dutch Disease: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dutch_disease https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dutch_disease [1] https://fred.stlouisfed.org/graph/?g=eMGt https://fred.stlouisfed.org/graph/?g=eMGt

thriftwy 3y ago
People didn't really need smartphones, laptops and even personal cars in 1960s in Argentine. I believe they generated that GDP while being mostly rural, where it translates to a lot of amenities. Now they would usually be cramped in a city where the effective cost of living is much greater (leading to villas), whereas their GDP and thus income didn't grow much.
- Wytwwww 3y ago
  70-80%+ of the population was already living in urban areas in the 60s though.
  - thriftwy 3y ago
    Perhaps we've spotted a case for sloggy Argentinean growth, since the country doesn't strike me as being an industrial giant or a R&D hub - what would they all do living in urban areas?
    - MichaelZuo 3y ago
      A huge portion of the population in the cities doesn't do anything, quite literally living on the government budget. Hence why the poverty rate near instantly skyrocketed after the huge cuts to government spending recently.
    - pjc50 3y ago
      ?? Urban areas are just the default for the 20th century, let alone the 21st. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economy_of_Argentina https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economy_of_Argentina is surprisingly comprehensive. The sidebar has agriculture at 7% of the economy. The place is not without industry, it's just making and selling things at ""wrong"" prices because of the currency issue, which in turn comes from the balance of payments issue. There's clearly substantial local commerce, just not quite enough export.
      - thriftwy 3y ago
        What % of exports, though, and what % of exports to the countries outside of the region (i.e. the globally competitive industries)? Even by world standards, 70-80% of urbanization in the 60s and 92% now is quite a lot. Especially a lot for a country which mostly exports agricultural produce. Without checking, I would expect it to be 50% in the 60s and 70-80% today.

epolanski 3y ago

Inflation is a symptom, not the cause. Not sure how Argentinians are supposed to do better using cryptocurrencies.

froblesmartin 3y ago
Well, at least you can save and not be in the need to spend your money soon, as it then devalues quickly, which helps to stop inflation :D They could just search € or USD, which they do :D But the government used to have a cap of 200$ per person and month to exchange (not sure if that still happens now with Milei)
- Wytwwww 3y ago
  On the whole income be significantly lower because the state couldn't afford to pay them as much (or at all) anymore.
- pjc50 3y ago
  The inflation is still a symptom of the balance of payments problem. What cryptocurrency lets you do is evade the capital controls and get closer to dollar-referenced currency.
GaryNumanVevo 3y ago
They'd be better off holding literally any _other_ currency. US dollars are hard to get in large quantities, and you'd be stuck holding a lot of cash. Bitcoin (or any crypto currency, BTC isn't unique here) is just easier to buy and hold as a hedge against inflation
- thriftwy 3y ago
  I've never seen issues with obtaining any required quantity of physical US dollars cash, and that includes 2022 Russia.
7thaccount 3y ago
There is no federal agency or corporation that can inflate Bitcoin like Argentina's central bank has been doing. This is the major cause of inflation.

yard2010 3y ago

Been there in 2014 with a group of friends. We ran out of cash. I took the ferry to Uruguay with 4 credit cards and for a day each 2 hours draw the max sum the ATM let me. Returned with 4k dollars in my pockets. Not before I bought something to smoke and smoked a big doobie on the beach in the sunset. God, I miss this muchileros life.

braza 3y ago

2 small pieces of anecdotes 1) I used to work in a very large IT group in Latin America, and I worked with some EngManagers who hired and managed some folks in Argentina. One interesting dynamic was due to the inflation, we used to give to folks 'monthly' salary increases to offset. Since the company captured the inflation also in the prices, for a long time offer that offset with a small plus was a very huge retention factor for us; 2) After 2015/6, our IT director started to give 1 Bitcoin or USD 500 equivalent in Bitcoin for our argentine colleagues as part of their monthly salary, and eventually those guys ended up holding or selling it with more than 10x over it.

sergiotapia 3y ago

The Crystal language was written by gauchos!

cassianoleal 3y ago
So was Godot, the open source gaming engine.