4 ms·

The Tea Party and malignant Trumpism would have developed under a president McCain as anything else.

by Aloha 3y ago

eadmund 3y ago
I don’t think that’s true. The development of the Tea Party comprised several causes: the anti-constitutional attitudes of the Obama administration; Mr. Obama’s personal anti-American character; the general incompetence of the Obama administration; and, sadly, racism (I did not appreciate at the time how many of the folks who were vocal about the former factors were motivated by this last, utterly disgraceful, factor). These factors would have been lessened to one degree or another — or altogether missing — in a hypothetical McCain administration. Granted, hypotheticals are always tricky, and one can’t predict what sort of malignant reaction a McCain administration would have provoked.
- no_wizard 3y ago
  >the anti-constitutional attitudes of the Obama administration; Mr. Obama’s personal anti-American character; the general incompetence of the Obama administration These are some pretty big things to posit without some citations. Simply put I don't remember anything of this nature, at all, with the exception of the prevalence of racism. I'm not saying Obama and his administration didn't have faults (they sure did) but like I said, other than the prevalence of racism, nothing else rings true.
  - blindriver 3y ago
    You don't remember Obama's campaign of "Change we can believe in" and then he enacted every single Bush policy, and even kept their timelines? If you were a progressive left, you hated Obama as much as the American Taliban right hated Obama. He betrayed every single progressive ideal he supposedly stood for, including publicly and vehemently being against gay marriage for both presidential debates. He also signed the NDAA just before Christmas, which was the most anti-constitutional piece of legislation that you could conceive at the time. Obama kept talking about gun control, but Trump did more for gun control by banning bumpstocks than Obama ever did.
  - eadmund 3y ago
    > These are some pretty big things to posit without some citations. They really should be common knowledge. Among many other examples: the Chrysler bailout violated the Takings and Due Process clauses; the use of the IRS to persecute political foes violated equal protection; he started his political career with a fundraiser in the home of two violent terrorists, the founder and leader of the Weather Underground (this on its own should have disqualified him as a candidate for any civically-minded party); he is noted for such gaffes as referring to ISIS as the ‘jayvee [junior varsity] team’ and mistakes such as the premature 2011 withdrawal from Iraq which opened the door for the Islamic State, as well as for such poor domestic politics that his party lost over 1,000 seats. Not all criticism of or disagreement with him was well-founded or well-motivated — as I noted, I failed to recognise at the time how many of his foes had racist motives — but he really was a profoundly bad president. edit: grammar
tharmas 3y ago
Didn't it really start with Newt Gingrich in the 90's? "Contract with America" etc. Also, I would argue that Trumpism, at least from his base's point of view, is about challenging the Establishment. Sure, Trump is nasty and in no way deserving of the anointment as challenger of the Establishment but he's skillfully bamboozled his supporters into believing it. Trumpers are right about one thing: the Establishment are an absolute abomination.

The Tea Party and malignant Trumpism would have developed under a president McCain as anything else.

by Aloha 3y ago

The Tea Party and malignant Trumpism would have developed under a president McCain as anything else.

I don’t think that’s true. The development of the Tea Party comprised several causes: the anti-constitutional attitudes of the Obama administration; Mr. Obama’s personal anti-American character; the general incompetence of the Obama administration; and, sadly, racism (I did not appreciate at the time how many of the folks who were vocal about the former factors were motivated by this last, utterly disgraceful, factor). These factors would have been lessened to one degree or another — or altogether missing — in a hypothetical McCain administration. Granted, hypotheticals are always tricky, and one can’t predict what sort of malignant reaction a McCain administration would have provoked.

no_wizard 3y ago
>the anti-constitutional attitudes of the Obama administration; Mr. Obama’s personal anti-American character; the general incompetence of the Obama administration These are some pretty big things to posit without some citations. Simply put I don't remember anything of this nature, at all, with the exception of the prevalence of racism. I'm not saying Obama and his administration didn't have faults (they sure did) but like I said, other than the prevalence of racism, nothing else rings true.
- blindriver 3y ago
  You don't remember Obama's campaign of "Change we can believe in" and then he enacted every single Bush policy, and even kept their timelines? If you were a progressive left, you hated Obama as much as the American Taliban right hated Obama. He betrayed every single progressive ideal he supposedly stood for, including publicly and vehemently being against gay marriage for both presidential debates. He also signed the NDAA just before Christmas, which was the most anti-constitutional piece of legislation that you could conceive at the time. Obama kept talking about gun control, but Trump did more for gun control by banning bumpstocks than Obama ever did.
- eadmund 3y ago
  > These are some pretty big things to posit without some citations. They really should be common knowledge. Among many other examples: the Chrysler bailout violated the Takings and Due Process clauses; the use of the IRS to persecute political foes violated equal protection; he started his political career with a fundraiser in the home of two violent terrorists, the founder and leader of the Weather Underground (this on its own should have disqualified him as a candidate for any civically-minded party); he is noted for such gaffes as referring to ISIS as the ‘jayvee [junior varsity] team’ and mistakes such as the premature 2011 withdrawal from Iraq which opened the door for the Islamic State, as well as for such poor domestic politics that his party lost over 1,000 seats. Not all criticism of or disagreement with him was well-founded or well-motivated — as I noted, I failed to recognise at the time how many of his foes had racist motives — but he really was a profoundly bad president. edit: grammar

tharmas 3y ago

Didn't it really start with Newt Gingrich in the 90's? "Contract with America" etc. Also, I would argue that Trumpism, at least from his base's point of view, is about challenging the Establishment. Sure, Trump is nasty and in no way deserving of the anointment as challenger of the Establishment but he's skillfully bamboozled his supporters into believing it. Trumpers are right about one thing: the Establishment are an absolute abomination.