3 ms·

Sure this situation already exists on Mac OS but that is a much smaller user base and there are plenty of alternatives where you can go and install arbitrary so

Sure this situation already exists on Mac OS but that is a much smaller user base and there are plenty of alternatives where you can go and install arbitrary software. I deal with weird stuff my parents have installed on their Macs every time I visit… so far I haven’t had to do that with their phones. If I wanted them to use a Firefox browser engine on their phone I’d get them an Android.

Lacusch 3y ago
Yeah but then they just won't chage the browser enginr and nothing will change. I don't think your parents would go out of their way to change the browser engine or am I missing something?
- dwighttk 3y ago
  They don’t go out of their way to install anything on their macs… every time I ask them about how their computers get this way and they do not know. I suspect my dad is just clicking anything that gets in the way of his puzzle games. Not sure what gets mom.
devnullbrain 3y ago
It's so funny that every HN post on this topic produces more and more contrived reasons for why having less choice is better, actually. Today: my parents need to be coddled like children, so you don't get to install a new browser. It's only because Apple's legal wrangling failed that Android even exists today.
- dwighttk 3y ago
  You do get to install a new browser, on a platform you’d prefer, one that is open and supports choice, go over there.
  - devnullbrain 3y ago
    No. Follow the law.
    - dwighttk 3y ago
      Thankfully it is only a bad law in the European Union.
      - devnullbrain 3y ago
        And it's a good law elsewhere? :) You're also welcome not to buy a phone for your parents. It would be disingenuous for me to suggest you actually do so, because we all make choices under duress or with limited options.
        dwighttk 3y ago
        If this bad law were to cross the Atlantic I would still buy my parents their phones and deal with the situation. I’m glad I don’t have to while it remains outside the US. And I’m glad I don’t have to deal with it on my own phone, even if I’m better equipped to deal with it. And I’m glad people are still free to change to different browser engines inside the US without the law.
        smoldesu 3y ago
        I'm really sorry that your emotional wellbeing is predicated on the exploitative practice of a multinational company. You should have seen this coming. Bell Telephone didn't get away from litigation for "securing" telecommunications infrastructure under one body. Microsoft didn't foil antitrust litigation for "protecting" users from third-party browsers. Expecting Apple to escape broader antitrust scrutiny is a pipe dream. You should probably plan accordingly.
        dwighttk 3y ago
        What did I say that had anything to do with emotional wellbeing? What did I say that made you think I was unprepared for Apple to have to do this in the US?
- asadotzler 3y ago
  This site stopped being for actual hackers at least 5 years ago, maybe more. These people are the opposite of hackers, literally begging for and defending walled gardens and closed systems. What a joke this community has become over the years.
  - gls2ro 3y ago
    Or could it be that the parents of most people who were live on this website 15, or even 10 years ago were not using computers, and the parents of the younger generation on this website are using computers? So maybe people want their parents to avoid getting scammed or having their money stolen from their accounts.
    - dwighttk 3y ago
      Clearly if you aren’t personally capable of auditing an entire OS you deserve the security holes you get. Which sorta makes me wonder why these “actual hackers” even bother to care about iOS.
JKCalhoun 3y ago
Yeah, I thought the Mac comparison was easy to digest, but ultimately left me feeling still a little hungry. I'm thinking those that would install malware are obviously going to target the platform that is always online and that sells millions of units. I remember how few Mac viruses there were back in the 90's vs. the PC platform. I don't think it had anything to do with System 7 security. ;-) I'm not sure though if it wouldn't in fact hurt Apple's brand to give up the fight and instead install a big lever you can throw when you set up your iOS device that says, "Turn off security". Apple seems to be saying instead, you have choice — buy an Android. I've never owned an Android though so I can say, is it rife with malware and other security compromises? Is the platform as hardened as iOS? Or it another case where the market is not as appealing as the iOS market to malware developers?

Lacusch 3y ago

Yeah but then they just won't chage the browser enginr and nothing will change. I don't think your parents would go out of their way to change the browser engine or am I missing something?

dwighttk 3y ago
They don’t go out of their way to install anything on their macs… every time I ask them about how their computers get this way and they do not know. I suspect my dad is just clicking anything that gets in the way of his puzzle games. Not sure what gets mom.

devnullbrain 3y ago

It's so funny that every HN post on this topic produces more and more contrived reasons for why having less choice is better, actually. Today: my parents need to be coddled like children, so you don't get to install a new browser. It's only because Apple's legal wrangling failed that Android even exists today.

dwighttk 3y ago
You do get to install a new browser, on a platform you’d prefer, one that is open and supports choice, go over there.
- devnullbrain 3y ago
  No. Follow the law.
  - dwighttk 3y ago
    Thankfully it is only a bad law in the European Union.
    - devnullbrain 3y ago
      And it's a good law elsewhere? :) You're also welcome not to buy a phone for your parents. It would be disingenuous for me to suggest you actually do so, because we all make choices under duress or with limited options.
      - dwighttk 3y ago
        If this bad law were to cross the Atlantic I would still buy my parents their phones and deal with the situation. I’m glad I don’t have to while it remains outside the US. And I’m glad I don’t have to deal with it on my own phone, even if I’m better equipped to deal with it. And I’m glad people are still free to change to different browser engines inside the US without the law.
        smoldesu 3y ago
        I'm really sorry that your emotional wellbeing is predicated on the exploitative practice of a multinational company. You should have seen this coming. Bell Telephone didn't get away from litigation for "securing" telecommunications infrastructure under one body. Microsoft didn't foil antitrust litigation for "protecting" users from third-party browsers. Expecting Apple to escape broader antitrust scrutiny is a pipe dream. You should probably plan accordingly.
        dwighttk 3y ago
        What did I say that had anything to do with emotional wellbeing? What did I say that made you think I was unprepared for Apple to have to do this in the US?
asadotzler 3y ago
This site stopped being for actual hackers at least 5 years ago, maybe more. These people are the opposite of hackers, literally begging for and defending walled gardens and closed systems. What a joke this community has become over the years.
- gls2ro 3y ago
  Or could it be that the parents of most people who were live on this website 15, or even 10 years ago were not using computers, and the parents of the younger generation on this website are using computers? So maybe people want their parents to avoid getting scammed or having their money stolen from their accounts.
  - dwighttk 3y ago
    Clearly if you aren’t personally capable of auditing an entire OS you deserve the security holes you get. Which sorta makes me wonder why these “actual hackers” even bother to care about iOS.

JKCalhoun 3y ago

Yeah, I thought the Mac comparison was easy to digest, but ultimately left me feeling still a little hungry. I'm thinking those that would install malware are obviously going to target the platform that is always online and that sells millions of units. I remember how few Mac viruses there were back in the 90's vs. the PC platform. I don't think it had anything to do with System 7 security. ;-) I'm not sure though if it wouldn't in fact hurt Apple's brand to give up the fight and instead install a big lever you can throw when you set up your iOS device that says, "Turn off security". Apple seems to be saying instead, you have choice — buy an Android. I've never owned an Android though so I can say, is it rife with malware and other security compromises? Is the platform as hardened as iOS? Or it another case where the market is not as appealing as the iOS market to malware developers?