6 ms·

Torrentfreak's articles seem to get better and better. They note the ways in which piracy is hurting films (foreign sales) and show some numbers indicating that

Torrentfreak's articles seem to get better and better. They note the ways in which piracy is hurting films (foreign sales) and show some numbers indicating that in the US it doesn't appear to be hurting sales much at all. While obviously torrentfreak can't ever be considered objective in regards to piracy, they seem to be getting closer each time. Back on topic then, Does anyone have the background necessary to know if someone (anyone) is working towards disrupting the complicated publishing mess that keeps films from being available overseas for so long.

yirt 14y ago
Well, the pirates are 'disrupting' it rather effectively. But through more official channels, there's not much which can be done until rights-holders wise up. They have been and remain the core bottleneck.
jcampbell1 14y ago
I am perplexed by your comment about overseas release dates. There has been an absolutely massive compression in release dates in the past 5 years. Most obvious blockbusters are now globally released, and the spread for smaller films has also been contracting. Avengers was released overseas prior to the US release. A film like The Descendants was released 4 weeks early in NY/LA, and then foreign releases were only 6 weeks after the US release. That is insanely fast for a movie that could potentially have never made it out of NY/LA.
- tseabrooks 14y ago
  I'm taking that info from the article. It was proposed as one of the reasons that piracy over seas is so prolific.
- rickmb 14y ago
  This only involves the top blockbusters. For most other US produced movies the waiting time for releases can easily be well over 6 months. Besides, 6 weeks is still a long time in the age of instant global communication. Basically, all the hype and buzz surrounding a film starts well before the release and dramatically drops a week after. After a month, people have pretty much forgotten about it. This hurts sales even without piracy, because the artificially created urgency (why do you thing so many people go see a movie in the opening week?) has gone. There is no alternative for simultaneous release that doesn't hurt sales, piracy or not.
  - jcampbell1 14y ago
    I agree that simultaneous releases are best for sales, but that ignores reality. Lets assume 400 movies are screened per year in NY/LA, 200 widely in the US, and 125 in foreign theaters. It is simply not possible for all 400 movies to have a simultaneous global release. Theater owners must take a "wait and see" approach for many films. I also don't agree with your 6 month figure, but I'd be happy to be proven wrong. Release dates are widely published. Comedies tend to have the slowest rollout because it takes time to prove that the humor translates well. Even with comedies, I can't find anything where the wide US release is 6 months before foreign releases.
    - robryan 14y ago
      Movies like the saw series seemed to do this fine, opened pretty much everywhere one the same day. Sure not every movie can get the same limited screen space, but the big movies that are getting the most online downloads probably can.
    - moe 14y ago
      It is simply not possible for all 400 movies to have a simultaneous global release. Theater owners must take a "wait and see" approach for many films. Who cares about theaters? I haven't been in a movie theater in 5 years - it just doesn't appeal to me at all. And I know for a fact that many of my friends who used to be cinema-buffs don't care much anymore either. We prefer to watch films in our home-cinemas now, on a big flatscreen or beamer. Consequently we use the first release in watchable quality that we can get. And often that's from PirateBay. Not because we'd be unwilling to pay $9.99 for a HD movie on iTunes, but simply because most movies appear 6 months earlier on the torrents. If iTunes launched in parallel with the theaters we would buy all movies.
      - thirdsun 14y ago
        You're right. I'm from germany and haven't been in a theater for years but I own a beamer. Additionally going to a theater would involve driving about 50 km just to get there as I live in a rural area. Furthermore I prefer to watch movies in their original language (well, as long as it is english). I wish movie distribution was up to the standards we expect when buying music these days. Ditch DRM, just offer me the files and let me re-download them at any time via my account. Streaming is an option but for me bandwith is limited (speed, not volume) while harddisk space is cheap. Plus XBMC + Apple TV + NAS lets me build up my own film archive. unfortunately and in contrast to the process of buying music we aren't there yet with movies.
- jswanson 14y ago
  Japan still lags behind the US for most big-ticket films. Avengers won't open here until 2012/08/17, more than three months after the US release date. [1] That's a month ahead of the projected blu-ray release of the film though. It's really hit and miss, but most of the more major films lag by two to three months. 1 - http://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E3%82%A2%E3%83%99%E3%83%B3%E3%82%B8%E3%83%A3%E3%83%BC%E3%82%BA_(2012%E5%B9%B4%E3%81%AE%E6%98%A0%E7%94%BB) http://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E3%82%A2%E3%83%99%E3%83%B3%E3%...
  - DeepDuh 14y ago
    Japan probably has one of the lowest piracy rates, so they don't seem to be forced to release earlier there. Japan's own media is even more backwards, most of their media never gets international releases although there is a big fansub scene. They don't seem to need the money.
    - ekianjo 14y ago
      > They don't seem to need the money. Oh no, they DO need the money, believe me. Most of their productions take years to just break even, and some never do. The reason why they are not actively pursuing international releases is linked to the way Japanese do business. Most of these media companies are very traditional and do not understand the opportunities outside of Japan. And even if they did, they'd need to get the approval of an old 社長 to proceed with such plans. This happens very rarely. They are missing a huge market.
      - DeepDuh 14y ago
        I know. That sentence was of course sarcastic ;). It's a shame too, because a lot of their media has that special charm and its artistic value is sometimes quite high IMO (especially in the anime department).
    - delackner 14y ago
      Fansubs (japanese subtitles) of foreign movie releases? Where is this scene? I can't watch an english language movie with Japanese friends until the J release without J subtitles.
- ekianjo 14y ago
  > Most obvious blockbusters are now globally released Not true. Avengers is not even out in Japan yet. It wont be out until later summer (August). I can't believe they are delaying it for so long. And Japan is a BIG market for movies.
  - jcampbell1 14y ago
    Japan is a unique market for movies. No good dubbing studios, a flaky box office, and weird taste in movies. Since you live there, and seem to have a good handle on English, I suggest you just pirate the movies and watch them in English. Japan is the exception to all my comments.
    - ekianjo 14y ago
      -- no good dubbing studio. GOD you are damn right on this one. Dubbing studios in Japan are just horrible. Honestly i dont understand how Japan can both have excellent voice over studios for animation and extremely bad ones for western movies. There s something deeply wrong going on there.
    - ekianjo 14y ago
      For some movies i dont mind doing what you recommend, but for avengers theres no way i will settle with watching it at home. The same thing happened with Drive last year (its only out NOW in Japan) and that really pisses me off.
  - flocial 14y ago
    I'd also add that the language barrier and the fact that torrenting isn't as popular as other countries makes it easier for Hollywood to rely on traditional box office and DVD sales in Japan. That and the fact that they probably have a lot of binding distribution deals with the big dubbing/distribution houses.
- wyclif 14y ago
  This is true. I was in the Philippines when Avatar was released, and it was the same day as the US release. It used to be that you could see a new movie in the US and travel to SE Asia the next day and by the time you got there nobody would have seen it for weeks or months after.
jcr 14y ago
I certainly do not qualify for "have the background" but I do have some information. One part is cost of reproduction; it's rumored to cost $1,500 for each reproduced film reel set. The current work (that I know about) is the move towards digital distribution. http://singularityhub.com/2012/04/27/movie-theaters-ramp-up-for-the-next-big-thing-satellite-delivery-of-digital-films/ http://singularityhub.com/2012/04/27/movie-theaters-ramp-up-... Another part is translation. Though language barriers have been decreasing during the last two decades, they still exist, and most people prefer to watch movies in their native language, or at least have subtitles in a language they know well. Various "fan groups" release subtitled versions of their favorite anime, and at least to some degree, this addresses the time delay of translation. More importantly, the entertainment industry has been slowly learning from the fan subbing groups. A good example would be the partnership between entertainment companies (read: investors) and groups like CrunchyRoll which does and distributes officially sanctioned, subtitled (re)releases a short time after the programs have originally aired. http://www.crunchyroll.com/ http://www.crunchyroll.com/ Though the former could easily be considered just cost cutting, the latter is undoubtedly due to pressure from alternate distribution channels.
- cdr 14y ago
  My local indie theater recently ran a substantial (for them) fundraising campaign to upgrade to digital. They claimed that within a year or two, the major studios were going digital only and any theater without digital would be completely shut out. I didn't verify this, but I have no reason to doubt them.
  - waterlesscloud 14y ago
    Fox just announced officially that they will cease all 35mm print distribution within 2 years.
    - ChiperSoft 14y ago
      As a film geek, this news saddens me so much....
  - 14y ago
nekojima 14y ago
The change will come through digital distribution of the movies to cinemas, instead of the physical reel method that has been used since movies were first shown in cinemas. The main reasons these movies take so long to distribute outside of North America has been because of local content & distribution rules for movies, risk assessment for success from distributors and, importantly, studios not wanting to spend extra money on new or extra reels when they can just use those from North America after a few months in overseas markets.
teamonkey 14y ago
> Torrentfreak's articles seem to get better and better. I disagree. They're intensely biased, they select only information that suits their agenda and they spin reports and statistics shamelessly. That's not to say that they're entirely worthless as a news source but they do have to be treated as a mouthpiece.
- dredmorbius 14y ago
  Unlike, say, the MPAA and the mainstream entertainment-media industrial complex comprising it. Sometimes triangulation between propaganda artists points you at the truth. Or at least illuminates what each side prefers you not see.

yirt 14y ago

Well, the pirates are 'disrupting' it rather effectively. But through more official channels, there's not much which can be done until rights-holders wise up. They have been and remain the core bottleneck.

jcampbell1 14y ago

I am perplexed by your comment about overseas release dates. There has been an absolutely massive compression in release dates in the past 5 years. Most obvious blockbusters are now globally released, and the spread for smaller films has also been contracting. Avengers was released overseas prior to the US release. A film like The Descendants was released 4 weeks early in NY/LA, and then foreign releases were only 6 weeks after the US release. That is insanely fast for a movie that could potentially have never made it out of NY/LA.

tseabrooks 14y ago
I'm taking that info from the article. It was proposed as one of the reasons that piracy over seas is so prolific.
rickmb 14y ago
This only involves the top blockbusters. For most other US produced movies the waiting time for releases can easily be well over 6 months. Besides, 6 weeks is still a long time in the age of instant global communication. Basically, all the hype and buzz surrounding a film starts well before the release and dramatically drops a week after. After a month, people have pretty much forgotten about it. This hurts sales even without piracy, because the artificially created urgency (why do you thing so many people go see a movie in the opening week?) has gone. There is no alternative for simultaneous release that doesn't hurt sales, piracy or not.
- jcampbell1 14y ago
  I agree that simultaneous releases are best for sales, but that ignores reality. Lets assume 400 movies are screened per year in NY/LA, 200 widely in the US, and 125 in foreign theaters. It is simply not possible for all 400 movies to have a simultaneous global release. Theater owners must take a "wait and see" approach for many films. I also don't agree with your 6 month figure, but I'd be happy to be proven wrong. Release dates are widely published. Comedies tend to have the slowest rollout because it takes time to prove that the humor translates well. Even with comedies, I can't find anything where the wide US release is 6 months before foreign releases.
  - robryan 14y ago
    Movies like the saw series seemed to do this fine, opened pretty much everywhere one the same day. Sure not every movie can get the same limited screen space, but the big movies that are getting the most online downloads probably can.
  - moe 14y ago
    It is simply not possible for all 400 movies to have a simultaneous global release. Theater owners must take a "wait and see" approach for many films. Who cares about theaters? I haven't been in a movie theater in 5 years - it just doesn't appeal to me at all. And I know for a fact that many of my friends who used to be cinema-buffs don't care much anymore either. We prefer to watch films in our home-cinemas now, on a big flatscreen or beamer. Consequently we use the first release in watchable quality that we can get. And often that's from PirateBay. Not because we'd be unwilling to pay $9.99 for a HD movie on iTunes, but simply because most movies appear 6 months earlier on the torrents. If iTunes launched in parallel with the theaters we would buy all movies.
    - thirdsun 14y ago
      You're right. I'm from germany and haven't been in a theater for years but I own a beamer. Additionally going to a theater would involve driving about 50 km just to get there as I live in a rural area. Furthermore I prefer to watch movies in their original language (well, as long as it is english). I wish movie distribution was up to the standards we expect when buying music these days. Ditch DRM, just offer me the files and let me re-download them at any time via my account. Streaming is an option but for me bandwith is limited (speed, not volume) while harddisk space is cheap. Plus XBMC + Apple TV + NAS lets me build up my own film archive. unfortunately and in contrast to the process of buying music we aren't there yet with movies.
jswanson 14y ago
Japan still lags behind the US for most big-ticket films. Avengers won't open here until 2012/08/17, more than three months after the US release date. [1] That's a month ahead of the projected blu-ray release of the film though. It's really hit and miss, but most of the more major films lag by two to three months. 1 - http://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E3%82%A2%E3%83%99%E3%83%B3%E3%82%B8%E3%83%A3%E3%83%BC%E3%82%BA_(2012%E5%B9%B4%E3%81%AE%E6%98%A0%E7%94%BB) http://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E3%82%A2%E3%83%99%E3%83%B3%E3%...
- DeepDuh 14y ago
  Japan probably has one of the lowest piracy rates, so they don't seem to be forced to release earlier there. Japan's own media is even more backwards, most of their media never gets international releases although there is a big fansub scene. They don't seem to need the money.
  - ekianjo 14y ago
    > They don't seem to need the money. Oh no, they DO need the money, believe me. Most of their productions take years to just break even, and some never do. The reason why they are not actively pursuing international releases is linked to the way Japanese do business. Most of these media companies are very traditional and do not understand the opportunities outside of Japan. And even if they did, they'd need to get the approval of an old 社長 to proceed with such plans. This happens very rarely. They are missing a huge market.
    - DeepDuh 14y ago
      I know. That sentence was of course sarcastic ;). It's a shame too, because a lot of their media has that special charm and its artistic value is sometimes quite high IMO (especially in the anime department).
  - delackner 14y ago
    Fansubs (japanese subtitles) of foreign movie releases? Where is this scene? I can't watch an english language movie with Japanese friends until the J release without J subtitles.
ekianjo 14y ago
> Most obvious blockbusters are now globally released Not true. Avengers is not even out in Japan yet. It wont be out until later summer (August). I can't believe they are delaying it for so long. And Japan is a BIG market for movies.
- jcampbell1 14y ago
  Japan is a unique market for movies. No good dubbing studios, a flaky box office, and weird taste in movies. Since you live there, and seem to have a good handle on English, I suggest you just pirate the movies and watch them in English. Japan is the exception to all my comments.
  - ekianjo 14y ago
    -- no good dubbing studio. GOD you are damn right on this one. Dubbing studios in Japan are just horrible. Honestly i dont understand how Japan can both have excellent voice over studios for animation and extremely bad ones for western movies. There s something deeply wrong going on there.
  - ekianjo 14y ago
    For some movies i dont mind doing what you recommend, but for avengers theres no way i will settle with watching it at home. The same thing happened with Drive last year (its only out NOW in Japan) and that really pisses me off.
- flocial 14y ago
  I'd also add that the language barrier and the fact that torrenting isn't as popular as other countries makes it easier for Hollywood to rely on traditional box office and DVD sales in Japan. That and the fact that they probably have a lot of binding distribution deals with the big dubbing/distribution houses.
wyclif 14y ago
This is true. I was in the Philippines when Avatar was released, and it was the same day as the US release. It used to be that you could see a new movie in the US and travel to SE Asia the next day and by the time you got there nobody would have seen it for weeks or months after.

jcr 14y ago

I certainly do not qualify for "have the background" but I do have some information. One part is cost of reproduction; it's rumored to cost $1,500 for each reproduced film reel set. The current work (that I know about) is the move towards digital distribution. http://singularityhub.com/2012/04/27/movie-theaters-ramp-up-for-the-next-big-thing-satellite-delivery-of-digital-films/ http://singularityhub.com/2012/04/27/movie-theaters-ramp-up-... Another part is translation. Though language barriers have been decreasing during the last two decades, they still exist, and most people prefer to watch movies in their native language, or at least have subtitles in a language they know well. Various "fan groups" release subtitled versions of their favorite anime, and at least to some degree, this addresses the time delay of translation. More importantly, the entertainment industry has been slowly learning from the fan subbing groups. A good example would be the partnership between entertainment companies (read: investors) and groups like CrunchyRoll which does and distributes officially sanctioned, subtitled (re)releases a short time after the programs have originally aired. http://www.crunchyroll.com/ http://www.crunchyroll.com/ Though the former could easily be considered just cost cutting, the latter is undoubtedly due to pressure from alternate distribution channels.

cdr 14y ago
My local indie theater recently ran a substantial (for them) fundraising campaign to upgrade to digital. They claimed that within a year or two, the major studios were going digital only and any theater without digital would be completely shut out. I didn't verify this, but I have no reason to doubt them.
- waterlesscloud 14y ago
  Fox just announced officially that they will cease all 35mm print distribution within 2 years.
  - ChiperSoft 14y ago
    As a film geek, this news saddens me so much....
- 14y ago

nekojima 14y ago

The change will come through digital distribution of the movies to cinemas, instead of the physical reel method that has been used since movies were first shown in cinemas. The main reasons these movies take so long to distribute outside of North America has been because of local content & distribution rules for movies, risk assessment for success from distributors and, importantly, studios not wanting to spend extra money on new or extra reels when they can just use those from North America after a few months in overseas markets.

teamonkey 14y ago

> Torrentfreak's articles seem to get better and better. I disagree. They're intensely biased, they select only information that suits their agenda and they spin reports and statistics shamelessly. That's not to say that they're entirely worthless as a news source but they do have to be treated as a mouthpiece.

dredmorbius 14y ago
Unlike, say, the MPAA and the mainstream entertainment-media industrial complex comprising it. Sometimes triangulation between propaganda artists points you at the truth. Or at least illuminates what each side prefers you not see.