3 ms·

Since your time is so valuable and you are obviously very upset about this, your company should pay Spotify to write a more efficient app. Or your company shou

Since your time is so valuable and you are obviously very upset about this, your company should pay Spotify to write a more efficient app. Or your company should buy you a new 96 core Threadripper 1 TB RAM system so that when you use Spotify/Slack/Postman it doesn't impact your productivity.

maccard 3y ago
If your only response is a personal attack, don't say anything at all.
- dist-epoch 3y ago
  I was just reflecting your thinking - somehow you feel that Postman/Slack/.... owe something to you. Pay them to do what you want, or stop using them. You feel entitled to use a $10K machine to compensate for slow IntelliJ for maximum productivity and convenience, yet deny others (Postman/Slack/...) using the most productive and convenient technology for them (Electron). And while continuing to use their convenient products, you say they are bad. Use IRC, use curl instead of Postman. The Postman programmers say the same thing: our users have $3K+ machines, no point in optimizing code to be fast, instead lets add more features since it's clearly working and our users are not switching. Obviously they love the iteration speed that Electron gives us.
  - maccard 3y ago
    > Pay them to do what you want, or stop using them. I've been a paying slack customer for a decade at this point. I pulled up my email, my support ticket for "slack is using more ram than visual studio" was in February 2015. I don't have the political sway over Salesforce to makthem make these sorts of decisions. > You feel entitled to use a $10K machine to compensate for slow... Youre doing it again. I don't feel entitled. I don't have a choice in my chat app, my employer forces it on me. And even if I did, slack is on the whole the least worst option. As for postman. I did the same thing. I was a paying customer, I submitted support tickets, provided traces when asked and ultimately I did decide to change tool. > while continuing to use their convenient products, you say they are bad. Am I not allowed to have an opinion just because I have a fast machine? Am I not allowed to want my software to be better? > The Postman programmers say the same thing: No they say "performance is a top priority for us, we're sorry you're not happy with it. Please send us your hardware specs" and the ticket gets auto closed after 2 weeks. > Obviously they love the iteration speed that Electron gives us. It's not just electron - snappy electron apps exist. Startup time aside. VSCode is pretty damn good. Figma is an excellent example of how good it can be (and if you want to compare what it looks like when a company cares Vs a company doesn't, see figma and Miro).
    - dist-epoch 3y ago
      > I've been a paying slack customer for a decade at this point $10/month is not what I meant by "paying them". I worked at a company where clients would routinely pay us $200K to implement a particular niche feature which was not on the roadmap. If they asked for a non-roadmap feature, yes, the ticket would be closed "not-planned".
      - cxr 3y ago
        You seem to be choosing to engage with your own least charitable inferences rather than what reflects your counterpart's actual position. Viz: > the alternative option isn't there > I don't feel entitled. I don't have a choice in my chat app Your responses are predicated on the option being there and the person you're responding to is just not taking it. This despite the fact that his or her responses strongly suggest they would take it if it were there, but it's simply not an option.
        dist-epoch 3y ago
        There is always an option. Threaten your employer you'll leave if they make you use Slack, quit programming and become a farmer who touches grass every day. All this Electron app complaining reads like First-World Problems(TM).
        maccard 3y ago
        Overly-reductionist arguments are not helpful. Suggesting that I quit my job because I disagree with the tech stack of a billion dollar company might be one of the dumbest things I've seen on this site in the 15 years or so I've been here.
        cxr 3y ago
        You know we can read back the comments that were posted in this thread and check your response against the context, right? You just moved the goalposts from being willing to pay for the product that would need to be changed to address the complaints, to refusing to use the software complained about.
zelphirkalt 3y ago
For me that wouldn't work, because the impact Slack has is not measured in time loss directly (or at least not only, since Slack is truly a laggy piece of crap), but instead in annoyance and feeling bad about using basically spyware on my system. Basically each interaction adds a bit of pain and questioning, why I am even doing this shit. Not GP, but they could buy me a 1024 core monster if it exists, it would still not solve the problem of Slack.
- guappa 3y ago
  I have been running localslackirc (it's in debian) to access slack from IRC. I still have to open it in the browser every once in a while, to search old threads or other stuff that is not supported. But day to day I can do everything in irc. There is also a weechat plugin afaik. It's a bit annoying to configure the access but it seems the tokens never expire (or have not yet expired) so it shouldn't be too frequent for you either.
  - zelphirkalt 3y ago
    Thanks, I might try that soon.

maccard 3y ago

If your only response is a personal attack, don't say anything at all.

dist-epoch 3y ago
I was just reflecting your thinking - somehow you feel that Postman/Slack/.... owe something to you. Pay them to do what you want, or stop using them. You feel entitled to use a $10K machine to compensate for slow IntelliJ for maximum productivity and convenience, yet deny others (Postman/Slack/...) using the most productive and convenient technology for them (Electron). And while continuing to use their convenient products, you say they are bad. Use IRC, use curl instead of Postman. The Postman programmers say the same thing: our users have $3K+ machines, no point in optimizing code to be fast, instead lets add more features since it's clearly working and our users are not switching. Obviously they love the iteration speed that Electron gives us.
- maccard 3y ago
  > Pay them to do what you want, or stop using them. I've been a paying slack customer for a decade at this point. I pulled up my email, my support ticket for "slack is using more ram than visual studio" was in February 2015. I don't have the political sway over Salesforce to makthem make these sorts of decisions. > You feel entitled to use a $10K machine to compensate for slow... Youre doing it again. I don't feel entitled. I don't have a choice in my chat app, my employer forces it on me. And even if I did, slack is on the whole the least worst option. As for postman. I did the same thing. I was a paying customer, I submitted support tickets, provided traces when asked and ultimately I did decide to change tool. > while continuing to use their convenient products, you say they are bad. Am I not allowed to have an opinion just because I have a fast machine? Am I not allowed to want my software to be better? > The Postman programmers say the same thing: No they say "performance is a top priority for us, we're sorry you're not happy with it. Please send us your hardware specs" and the ticket gets auto closed after 2 weeks. > Obviously they love the iteration speed that Electron gives us. It's not just electron - snappy electron apps exist. Startup time aside. VSCode is pretty damn good. Figma is an excellent example of how good it can be (and if you want to compare what it looks like when a company cares Vs a company doesn't, see figma and Miro).
  - dist-epoch 3y ago
    > I've been a paying slack customer for a decade at this point $10/month is not what I meant by "paying them". I worked at a company where clients would routinely pay us $200K to implement a particular niche feature which was not on the roadmap. If they asked for a non-roadmap feature, yes, the ticket would be closed "not-planned".
    - cxr 3y ago
      You seem to be choosing to engage with your own least charitable inferences rather than what reflects your counterpart's actual position. Viz: > the alternative option isn't there > I don't feel entitled. I don't have a choice in my chat app Your responses are predicated on the option being there and the person you're responding to is just not taking it. This despite the fact that his or her responses strongly suggest they would take it if it were there, but it's simply not an option.
      - dist-epoch 3y ago
        There is always an option. Threaten your employer you'll leave if they make you use Slack, quit programming and become a farmer who touches grass every day. All this Electron app complaining reads like First-World Problems(TM).
        maccard 3y ago
        Overly-reductionist arguments are not helpful. Suggesting that I quit my job because I disagree with the tech stack of a billion dollar company might be one of the dumbest things I've seen on this site in the 15 years or so I've been here.
        cxr 3y ago
        You know we can read back the comments that were posted in this thread and check your response against the context, right? You just moved the goalposts from being willing to pay for the product that would need to be changed to address the complaints, to refusing to use the software complained about.

zelphirkalt 3y ago

For me that wouldn't work, because the impact Slack has is not measured in time loss directly (or at least not only, since Slack is truly a laggy piece of crap), but instead in annoyance and feeling bad about using basically spyware on my system. Basically each interaction adds a bit of pain and questioning, why I am even doing this shit. Not GP, but they could buy me a 1024 core monster if it exists, it would still not solve the problem of Slack.

guappa 3y ago
I have been running localslackirc (it's in debian) to access slack from IRC. I still have to open it in the browser every once in a while, to search old threads or other stuff that is not supported. But day to day I can do everything in irc. There is also a weechat plugin afaik. It's a bit annoying to configure the access but it seems the tokens never expire (or have not yet expired) so it shouldn't be too frequent for you either.
- zelphirkalt 3y ago
  Thanks, I might try that soon.