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It feels like the 'influencer economy' has money plus goods/services changing hands in return for reviews all over the place, and the bar for disclosing things

It feels like the 'influencer economy' has money plus goods/services changing hands in return for reviews all over the place, and the bar for disclosing things like affiliate links exists, but adherence to that bar is mixed with influencers, and enforcement of that bar also seems rare (at least in the US). Is it possible to believe that a travel influencer with 700,000 subscribers (plus whatever other channel statistics matter to doing these deals with Marketing departments; number of views, watch times, number of click throughs?) would expect a free flight, some accommodation, a food allowance, and some money in return for the time and effort to do the flight, edit a video, post it? Likely yes. Does that make it okay to post his personal details? No. But this does seem like the definition of "Fsck around; find out", given the influencer in question has posted lots of stuff *slamming* other businesses, and they've now done it in a country where the airline's response isn't illegal, and the airline isn't covered by IATA's code of conduct, so they have no recourse.

rado 3y ago
While Josh does indeed thrive on drama, AFAIK he never takes free flights or anything.
- prmoustache 3y ago
  How do you know that?
  - belter 3y ago
    To start with, we know his name is not Josh Cahill, but Aljoscha Wendholt...
  - rado 3y ago
    No glowing reviews
- FireBeyond 3y ago
  There is zero way to know that. When the cheesegrater Mac Pro launched in 2019, I was interested in one. I am also interested in photography. So I loved watching at least 6 or 8 videos from my favorite photography YouTubers unboxing and reviewing their launch day Mac Pro and Pro Display XDRs... All of which they'd "ordered". I put that in quotation marks because as I watched and rewatched these videos I noticed something: every. single. one. had exactly the same non-baseline spec: 18 core CPU, 384GB memory, Vega II Duo GPU and an 8TB SSD. And every single one had got the Pro Display XDR with the nano coating and the stand. And it wasn't a case of "maybe that ships faster", or anything, and besides, that's a $25K setup with the screen. Also, if you're a photographer, even if you're working on medium format digital, and 100MP images, you in no way shape or form need 384GB of memory, or that GPU - the whole thing was massively overspecced. For me, LightRoom / Capture One and Photoshop all did not break a sweat on my 12 core 192GB W5700X variant (which was mainly specced that way for other reasons). It was pretty obvious that though they may well have ordered one, that Apple had sent them all a launch day setup, all identically specced. They could substitute theirs when it arrived and send back the other unit, or whatever. But not one single one of them ever said anything about it.
  - whynotminot 3y ago
    I think the more interesting part here is you alleging a coverup of Apple supplying a review unit. Why? I think most YouTube channels actually brag when Apple sends them review units. It’s a sign they’ve made it — their channel is influential enough to have been noticed by Apple. Most channels are happy to let their followers in on that. My guess for what you’re noticing is that there’s also a (in my opinion kinda gross) trend of influencer types buying expensive kit, doing their review, and then returning within the window. In this case, it doesn’t surprise me that someone would spec out a unit well beyond their needs or means, because they don’t intend to actually pay for it.
    - FireBeyond 3y ago
      > I think most YouTube channels actually brag when Apple sends them review units. It’s a sign they’ve made it — their channel is influential enough to have been noticed by Apple. Most channels are happy to let their followers in on that. I'd agree with that, generally. It's also true that in the photography sphere, there's a notable segment who are all about being "self-made", somewhat. That they're so successful. Their videos are "look at my new studio I'm constructing", "look at the six digits of gear I'm casually playing with", etc., to the point that for a few of them, people are quite well aware that photography is almost a sideline or hobby to them, and that their career is "YouTuber" (which is certainly valid)... it's the "when do you actually find time to do shoots?" vibe. > My guess for what you’re noticing is that there’s also a (in my opinion kinda gross) trend of influencer types buying expensive kit, doing their review, and then returning within the window. In this case, it doesn’t surprise me that someone would spec out a unit well beyond their needs or means, because they don’t intend to actually pay for it. What are the odds that 8 (that I found!) ordered the exact same CPU/memory/GPU/SSD spec?
      - tass 3y ago
        Was that the top spec, or top spec available for immediate shipping? In my experience Apple keeps a few different configurations ready for pick up or shipping, and their return policy sounds pretty flexible (though I haven’t personally had to use it for a major purchase).
mjevans 3y ago
Reporting the income paid to the IRS would lead to an easy to review disclosure stream for courts and other enforcement agencies. Normal workers and bankers have their income reported, so this money / value changing hands should be reported too. (Even if presently it isn't.)
ViktorRay 3y ago
In the article it says that the airline accused him of asking for a free flight but the airline has posted no evidence whatsoever that he has asked for this. In all likelihood the airline is lying. Furthermore the rest of your comment is oddly deferential to these airline companies. One should be able to post a negative review of any corporation’s product or service. You shouldn’t have to worry about retaliation for doing this. A negative review could be in the form of a written review or a YouTube review. Also the article talks about how this same person was banned by Qatar Airways after he posted a negative review of them. I’m shocked you say “fuck around and find out” in response to all this in your comment. How the heck is posting a negative review of a corporation’s service considered “fuck around”? How is retaliation by the corporations part of “find out”? Absurd
- lupusreal 3y ago
  > the airline accused him of asking for a free flight but the airline has posted no evidence whatsoever that he has asked for this. In all likelihood the airline is lying. What's your basis for that "in all likelihood"? My gut says P('influencer' asking for free shit) is near 100%. Isn't getting free shit from corps the whole point of being an 'influencer'? They're like mercenary-shills.
  - deleted 3y ago
    [deleted]
- addicted 3y ago
  I don’t know if the airline is lying or not, but the evidence for the airline lying is that the airline claimed Cahill demanded $50k which is “too rich” for an airline so he would never have asked for that much. I just want to point out the ridiculousness of saying $50k is too rich for a company flying planes which require 10s of millions of dollars as an upfront investment followed by 8-$10k per plane in fuel costs alone. So basically $50k isn’t even the fuel cost for flying a single plane from NY to LA. Of course, it’s ridiculous that the airline posted a copy of the passport and not the messages, which is the strongest evidence that they’re lying, not that the $50k demand is too ridiculous.

rado 3y ago

While Josh does indeed thrive on drama, AFAIK he never takes free flights or anything.

prmoustache 3y ago
How do you know that?
- belter 3y ago
  To start with, we know his name is not Josh Cahill, but Aljoscha Wendholt...
- rado 3y ago
  No glowing reviews
FireBeyond 3y ago
There is zero way to know that. When the cheesegrater Mac Pro launched in 2019, I was interested in one. I am also interested in photography. So I loved watching at least 6 or 8 videos from my favorite photography YouTubers unboxing and reviewing their launch day Mac Pro and Pro Display XDRs... All of which they'd "ordered". I put that in quotation marks because as I watched and rewatched these videos I noticed something: every. single. one. had exactly the same non-baseline spec: 18 core CPU, 384GB memory, Vega II Duo GPU and an 8TB SSD. And every single one had got the Pro Display XDR with the nano coating and the stand. And it wasn't a case of "maybe that ships faster", or anything, and besides, that's a $25K setup with the screen. Also, if you're a photographer, even if you're working on medium format digital, and 100MP images, you in no way shape or form need 384GB of memory, or that GPU - the whole thing was massively overspecced. For me, LightRoom / Capture One and Photoshop all did not break a sweat on my 12 core 192GB W5700X variant (which was mainly specced that way for other reasons). It was pretty obvious that though they may well have ordered one, that Apple had sent them all a launch day setup, all identically specced. They could substitute theirs when it arrived and send back the other unit, or whatever. But not one single one of them ever said anything about it.
- whynotminot 3y ago
  I think the more interesting part here is you alleging a coverup of Apple supplying a review unit. Why? I think most YouTube channels actually brag when Apple sends them review units. It’s a sign they’ve made it — their channel is influential enough to have been noticed by Apple. Most channels are happy to let their followers in on that. My guess for what you’re noticing is that there’s also a (in my opinion kinda gross) trend of influencer types buying expensive kit, doing their review, and then returning within the window. In this case, it doesn’t surprise me that someone would spec out a unit well beyond their needs or means, because they don’t intend to actually pay for it.
  - FireBeyond 3y ago
    > I think most YouTube channels actually brag when Apple sends them review units. It’s a sign they’ve made it — their channel is influential enough to have been noticed by Apple. Most channels are happy to let their followers in on that. I'd agree with that, generally. It's also true that in the photography sphere, there's a notable segment who are all about being "self-made", somewhat. That they're so successful. Their videos are "look at my new studio I'm constructing", "look at the six digits of gear I'm casually playing with", etc., to the point that for a few of them, people are quite well aware that photography is almost a sideline or hobby to them, and that their career is "YouTuber" (which is certainly valid)... it's the "when do you actually find time to do shoots?" vibe. > My guess for what you’re noticing is that there’s also a (in my opinion kinda gross) trend of influencer types buying expensive kit, doing their review, and then returning within the window. In this case, it doesn’t surprise me that someone would spec out a unit well beyond their needs or means, because they don’t intend to actually pay for it. What are the odds that 8 (that I found!) ordered the exact same CPU/memory/GPU/SSD spec?
    - tass 3y ago
      Was that the top spec, or top spec available for immediate shipping? In my experience Apple keeps a few different configurations ready for pick up or shipping, and their return policy sounds pretty flexible (though I haven’t personally had to use it for a major purchase).

mjevans 3y ago

Reporting the income paid to the IRS would lead to an easy to review disclosure stream for courts and other enforcement agencies. Normal workers and bankers have their income reported, so this money / value changing hands should be reported too. (Even if presently it isn't.)

ViktorRay 3y ago

In the article it says that the airline accused him of asking for a free flight but the airline has posted no evidence whatsoever that he has asked for this. In all likelihood the airline is lying. Furthermore the rest of your comment is oddly deferential to these airline companies. One should be able to post a negative review of any corporation’s product or service. You shouldn’t have to worry about retaliation for doing this. A negative review could be in the form of a written review or a YouTube review. Also the article talks about how this same person was banned by Qatar Airways after he posted a negative review of them. I’m shocked you say “fuck around and find out” in response to all this in your comment. How the heck is posting a negative review of a corporation’s service considered “fuck around”? How is retaliation by the corporations part of “find out”? Absurd

lupusreal 3y ago
> the airline accused him of asking for a free flight but the airline has posted no evidence whatsoever that he has asked for this. In all likelihood the airline is lying. What's your basis for that "in all likelihood"? My gut says P('influencer' asking for free shit) is near 100%. Isn't getting free shit from corps the whole point of being an 'influencer'? They're like mercenary-shills.
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]
addicted 3y ago
I don’t know if the airline is lying or not, but the evidence for the airline lying is that the airline claimed Cahill demanded $50k which is “too rich” for an airline so he would never have asked for that much. I just want to point out the ridiculousness of saying $50k is too rich for a company flying planes which require 10s of millions of dollars as an upfront investment followed by 8-$10k per plane in fuel costs alone. So basically $50k isn’t even the fuel cost for flying a single plane from NY to LA. Of course, it’s ridiculous that the airline posted a copy of the passport and not the messages, which is the strongest evidence that they’re lying, not that the $50k demand is too ridiculous.