5 ms·

I don't understand what the problem is with the windows!=applications paradigm, I GREATLY prefer it.

samatman 3y ago
Some people just want things to work the way they're used to. I'm one of those people, I find it rather annoying to deal with the windowing paradigm used in (most) Linux windows managers and Windows itself. So I'm not surprised when I see it in the other direction. I do wish it were possible to set up a macOS-flavored version of focus follows mouse, though. It would have to be adapted to the windowing paradigm, but I have some notes on how it could work. I don't expect Apple will ever add it and it would require deep hooks into many parts of the OS to offer it as an extension, so that's that. There's no perfect software, the only question is what you can live with out of the available options.
- jwells89 3y ago
  I wish there were a DE for Linux that replicated the Mac desktop paradigm. None currently do, even GNOME and Pantheon which people like to point to as the “Mac-like” DEs only aesthetically kinda resemble macOS… their windowing models are closer to a weird hybrid of Windows and iPadOS.
dieulot 3y ago
It’s an additional abstraction. On Windows/Linux closing an app requires doing the obvious thing. Press the big X, you’re done. You’re back to the previous app instantly. On Mac after closing a window what you see on the screen is a lie (besides the ever subtle menu bar and shades of gray); you’re still in the visually-hidden app.
- cmiller1 3y ago
  But why would closing a window close the program? If my program has many windows open which big X should close the program? Why shouldn't I be able to run a program without any windows open?
  - baal80spam 3y ago
    > If my program has many windows open which big X should close the program? The last one, obviously. > Why shouldn't I be able to run a program without any windows open? Because 99% of the time window IS a program. If a program has no windows, it is a process.
    - cmiller1 3y ago
      Why should a process and a program be different things? Sounds like an additional abstraction to me
whatever1 3y ago
There is absolutely 0 reasons why one would want to have a powerpoint/chrome/photoshop instance without a window. Calendars, emails, chats that need to run headless in the background live naturally on the top menu bar. And please spare us from "I want it to open fast". This should not be a user concern, the system should be smart enough to cache frequently used apps.
- cmiller1 3y ago
  If I have many documents open in one of those programs and I'm pressing the key commands to close a window and open a new window often I don't want open a new window to suddenly stop working because I didn't realize I had closed the last window.
- kcplate 3y ago
  > the system should be smart enough to cache frequently used apps I mean…isn’t it sort of doing that by allowing a windowless app instance?

Some people just want things to work the way they're used to. I'm one of those people, I find it rather annoying to deal with the windowing paradigm used in (most) Linux windows managers and Windows itself. So I'm not surprised when I see it in the other direction. I do wish it were possible to set up a macOS-flavored version of focus follows mouse, though. It would have to be adapted to the windowing paradigm, but I have some notes on how it could work. I don't expect Apple will ever add it and it would require deep hooks into many parts of the OS to offer it as an extension, so that's that. There's no perfect software, the only question is what you can live with out of the available options.

jwells89 3y ago
I wish there were a DE for Linux that replicated the Mac desktop paradigm. None currently do, even GNOME and Pantheon which people like to point to as the “Mac-like” DEs only aesthetically kinda resemble macOS… their windowing models are closer to a weird hybrid of Windows and iPadOS.

dieulot 3y ago

It’s an additional abstraction. On Windows/Linux closing an app requires doing the obvious thing. Press the big X, you’re done. You’re back to the previous app instantly. On Mac after closing a window what you see on the screen is a lie (besides the ever subtle menu bar and shades of gray); you’re still in the visually-hidden app.

cmiller1 3y ago
But why would closing a window close the program? If my program has many windows open which big X should close the program? Why shouldn't I be able to run a program without any windows open?
- baal80spam 3y ago
  > If my program has many windows open which big X should close the program? The last one, obviously. > Why shouldn't I be able to run a program without any windows open? Because 99% of the time window IS a program. If a program has no windows, it is a process.
  - cmiller1 3y ago
    Why should a process and a program be different things? Sounds like an additional abstraction to me

whatever1 3y ago

There is absolutely 0 reasons why one would want to have a powerpoint/chrome/photoshop instance without a window. Calendars, emails, chats that need to run headless in the background live naturally on the top menu bar. And please spare us from "I want it to open fast". This should not be a user concern, the system should be smart enough to cache frequently used apps.

cmiller1 3y ago
If I have many documents open in one of those programs and I'm pressing the key commands to close a window and open a new window often I don't want open a new window to suddenly stop working because I didn't realize I had closed the last window.
kcplate 3y ago
> the system should be smart enough to cache frequently used apps I mean…isn’t it sort of doing that by allowing a windowless app instance?