4 ms·

I don't see how any of the extra context undermines the point that the Ukraine war is primarily in response to NATO expansion. Why is it so hard for people to a

I don't see how any of the extra context undermines the point that the Ukraine war is primarily in response to NATO expansion. Why is it so hard for people to acknowledge?

emptysongglass 3y ago
The invasion of Ukraine is primarily a desire of conquest. NATO has nothing to do with it. The "request" from Russia is nothing more than a pretense for setting former satellites up for more invasion by their former masters. We know this is true from a map the dictator of Belarus was seen in front of showing more conquest after Ukraine, specifically of Moldova. We know President Vladimir V. Putin of Russia called the collapse of the Soviet empire “the greatest geopolitical catastrophe of the 20th century.” His desire for a return to the days of empire is obvious from every aggrandizing speech he makes.
- hackinthebochs 3y ago
  It is convenient that your worldview can absorb any contradictory information such that it all just demonstrates what you already take to be true. A truly masterful reality-distortion field.
- Ray20 3y ago
  >The invasion of Ukraine is primarily a desire of conquest. No. It is personal desire of Putin to remain in power. Conquest has nothing to do with it either.
  - emptysongglass 3y ago
    I'm not sure how you arrived at that conclusion given the available evidence we have of Putin's many speeches and writings on the matter. And one is not mutually exclusive of the other.
    - Ray20 3y ago
      Yeah, and he also gave many speeches and writings about how he is fighting Nazism in Ukraine. Are we seriously going to discuss Putin's speeches? This Putin's rhetoric did not exist before the 2014 revolution in Ukraine.
      - mopsi 3y ago
        It did exist. Putin's speech at the Munich Security Conference in 2007 is one of the best-known examples: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2007_Munich_speech_of_Vladimir_Putin https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2007_Munich_speech_of_Vladimir... His intentions have been obvious for a very long time for anyone who wants to see them. The recent Tucker Carlson interview confirmed that Putin has an uncontrollable obsession with a made up version of history, and he gets visibly upset when his long rants about Ukrainian statehood being an anti-Russian conspiracy by the Austrian General Staff and the Pope get interrupted. Nazis running Ukraine is only a small part of that persecution complex. Putin's speeches deserve as serious consideration as Hitler's. Until tanks started rolling, his speeches were also dismissed as rhetoric.
xdennis 3y ago
The Ukraine war started in 2014 when the Ukrainians wanted closer ties with the EU. It didn't start because of NATO. Stop trying to rewrite history.
- hackinthebochs 3y ago
  Not really. In 2014 Ukraine's NATO aspirations were codified into their constitution. Later that year Russia annexed Crimea and began a slow march towards the current war. To say it was about EU ties sans NATO is just gaslighting.

I don't see how any of the extra context undermines the point that the Ukraine war is primarily in response to NATO expansion. Why is it so hard for people to acknowledge?

emptysongglass 3y ago

The invasion of Ukraine is primarily a desire of conquest. NATO has nothing to do with it. The "request" from Russia is nothing more than a pretense for setting former satellites up for more invasion by their former masters. We know this is true from a map the dictator of Belarus was seen in front of showing more conquest after Ukraine, specifically of Moldova. We know President Vladimir V. Putin of Russia called the collapse of the Soviet empire “the greatest geopolitical catastrophe of the 20th century.” His desire for a return to the days of empire is obvious from every aggrandizing speech he makes.

hackinthebochs 3y ago
It is convenient that your worldview can absorb any contradictory information such that it all just demonstrates what you already take to be true. A truly masterful reality-distortion field.
Ray20 3y ago
>The invasion of Ukraine is primarily a desire of conquest. No. It is personal desire of Putin to remain in power. Conquest has nothing to do with it either.
- emptysongglass 3y ago
  I'm not sure how you arrived at that conclusion given the available evidence we have of Putin's many speeches and writings on the matter. And one is not mutually exclusive of the other.
  - Ray20 3y ago
    Yeah, and he also gave many speeches and writings about how he is fighting Nazism in Ukraine. Are we seriously going to discuss Putin's speeches? This Putin's rhetoric did not exist before the 2014 revolution in Ukraine.
    - mopsi 3y ago
      It did exist. Putin's speech at the Munich Security Conference in 2007 is one of the best-known examples: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2007_Munich_speech_of_Vladimir_Putin https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2007_Munich_speech_of_Vladimir... His intentions have been obvious for a very long time for anyone who wants to see them. The recent Tucker Carlson interview confirmed that Putin has an uncontrollable obsession with a made up version of history, and he gets visibly upset when his long rants about Ukrainian statehood being an anti-Russian conspiracy by the Austrian General Staff and the Pope get interrupted. Nazis running Ukraine is only a small part of that persecution complex. Putin's speeches deserve as serious consideration as Hitler's. Until tanks started rolling, his speeches were also dismissed as rhetoric.

xdennis 3y ago

The Ukraine war started in 2014 when the Ukrainians wanted closer ties with the EU. It didn't start because of NATO. Stop trying to rewrite history.

hackinthebochs 3y ago
Not really. In 2014 Ukraine's NATO aspirations were codified into their constitution. Later that year Russia annexed Crimea and began a slow march towards the current war. To say it was about EU ties sans NATO is just gaslighting.