4 ms·

The beautiful part of Kandan is courtesy of the design by Sacha Greif. He wrote an ebook about how he went about designing it, and it was discussed here: http:/

by sgrove 14y ago

The beautiful part of Kandan is courtesy of the design by Sacha Greif. He wrote an ebook about how he went about designing it, and it was discussed here: http://news.ycombinator.org/item?id=3731135 http://news.ycombinator.org/item?id=3731135 The amazing implementation is from a lot of hard work on Kevin Zettler's (my cofounder) part, who's amazing at polishing apps. Let us know your thoughts, and switch to using Kandan on Cloudfuji today :)

davedx 14y ago
Purely impersonal criticism, but I'm getting 'beautiful' fatigue from Show HN submissions. 'Beautiful' and 'amazing' in the same paragraph once sounded impressive, but now it's kind of tiresome. Like I said, this is nothing against you, it's more a general trend that I'm tired of seeing. Not everything on the web needs to be 'beautiful'.
- sgrove 14y ago
  Not everything needs to be beautiful, but we wanted to Kandan to be. We had a prototype of Kandan we called Kogo initially, but it was pretty ugly. We went out of our way to make sure that Kandan was as pleasant to use as possible, visually and functionally.
- oskarth 14y ago
  Agree. It's especially obnoxious if it comes from the author himself. It's the equivalent of having a tagline saying "I'm a smart developer who works hard" - it might be true but it's not your call, it's just a counter-signal. On second thought, I guess my criticism is more personal than yours, but I really think it's a kind of pollution that has no place in a somewhat clean community such as HN. EDIT: I do like the look of it, but I think everyone would be better of if you (you as in Cloudfuji, not the specific designer in question) used a neutral language. If someone goes on to say in the comments "That's beautiful." it's worth so much more for everyone involved.
  - sgrove 14y ago
    I didn't design Kandan, but I do think it's beautiful. And as I said, that's because of Sacha Greif's amazing work. Design in open source is - in general - sorely lacking. We want to correct that, and help herald in a new era of apps that are not only powerful, but easy to use and a joy to look at.
    - sgdesign 14y ago
      Thanks! I personally reserve words like "beautiful" for things like sunsets or mountains, but in any case I'm glad you find the design aesthetically pleasing :)
  - sgrove 14y ago
    Reply to the edit - I agree, we'll be less brazen with the next announcement. Thanks for the earnest feedback, we'll use it to iterate on our style.
- DanI-S 14y ago
  > Not everything on the web needs to be 'beautiful'. Is there anything in nature that isn't beautiful? Beauty comes from the optimal intersection of form and function; in nature, this balance is reached through evolution. That's what we should be striving for.
  - Natsu 14y ago
    > Is there anything in nature that isn't beautiful? Yes. I vote for the fruit of the doll's eyes plant personally, though bleeding tooth fungus is none too pleasant to look at, either.
- jff 14y ago
  I blame Steve Jobs: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gHZzb42s3y4 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gHZzb42s3y4 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nx7v815bYUw http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nx7v815bYUw
- ForrestN 14y ago
  I came here just to write exactly the same thing. I'd add that in this case, I personally don't find the product beautiful at all. It's not ugly, I don't find it visually offensive, but it's fairly generic and uses too many cliches for me to find it beautiful. Of course, beauty is mostly subjective. In order to wield it like, say, Apple does sometimes, you have to make something that a strong majority will find unusually beautiful.
emehrkay 14y ago
Read the book. Good stuff. I really liked the format.
moe 14y ago
I don't see much beautiful about it. It's a plain chat layout with too much whitespace for my taste. You know what's beautiful? A chat that I can theme and customize to match my definition of beautiful. This one doesn't even meet the minimum requirement of not being trapped in a browser. I want working keyboard shortcuts, I want detachable windows, and I want to copy/paste properly (browser chats give a garbled mess because your fancy CSS layout does not survive the process).
samstave 14y ago
I KNEW IT! I saw this UI and immediately recalled the ebook. I bought the ebook and reviewed it on HN. I thought the design was beautiful and elegant. This is GREAT to see it in a live app.

by sgrove 14y ago

davedx 14y ago

Purely impersonal criticism, but I'm getting 'beautiful' fatigue from Show HN submissions. 'Beautiful' and 'amazing' in the same paragraph once sounded impressive, but now it's kind of tiresome. Like I said, this is nothing against you, it's more a general trend that I'm tired of seeing. Not everything on the web needs to be 'beautiful'.

sgrove 14y ago
Not everything needs to be beautiful, but we wanted to Kandan to be. We had a prototype of Kandan we called Kogo initially, but it was pretty ugly. We went out of our way to make sure that Kandan was as pleasant to use as possible, visually and functionally.
oskarth 14y ago
Agree. It's especially obnoxious if it comes from the author himself. It's the equivalent of having a tagline saying "I'm a smart developer who works hard" - it might be true but it's not your call, it's just a counter-signal. On second thought, I guess my criticism is more personal than yours, but I really think it's a kind of pollution that has no place in a somewhat clean community such as HN. EDIT: I do like the look of it, but I think everyone would be better of if you (you as in Cloudfuji, not the specific designer in question) used a neutral language. If someone goes on to say in the comments "That's beautiful." it's worth so much more for everyone involved.
- sgrove 14y ago
  I didn't design Kandan, but I do think it's beautiful. And as I said, that's because of Sacha Greif's amazing work. Design in open source is - in general - sorely lacking. We want to correct that, and help herald in a new era of apps that are not only powerful, but easy to use and a joy to look at.
  - sgdesign 14y ago
    Thanks! I personally reserve words like "beautiful" for things like sunsets or mountains, but in any case I'm glad you find the design aesthetically pleasing :)
- sgrove 14y ago
  Reply to the edit - I agree, we'll be less brazen with the next announcement. Thanks for the earnest feedback, we'll use it to iterate on our style.
DanI-S 14y ago
> Not everything on the web needs to be 'beautiful'. Is there anything in nature that isn't beautiful? Beauty comes from the optimal intersection of form and function; in nature, this balance is reached through evolution. That's what we should be striving for.
- Natsu 14y ago
  > Is there anything in nature that isn't beautiful? Yes. I vote for the fruit of the doll's eyes plant personally, though bleeding tooth fungus is none too pleasant to look at, either.
jff 14y ago
I blame Steve Jobs: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gHZzb42s3y4 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gHZzb42s3y4 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nx7v815bYUw http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nx7v815bYUw
ForrestN 14y ago
I came here just to write exactly the same thing. I'd add that in this case, I personally don't find the product beautiful at all. It's not ugly, I don't find it visually offensive, but it's fairly generic and uses too many cliches for me to find it beautiful. Of course, beauty is mostly subjective. In order to wield it like, say, Apple does sometimes, you have to make something that a strong majority will find unusually beautiful.

emehrkay 14y ago

Read the book. Good stuff. I really liked the format.

moe 14y ago

I don't see much beautiful about it. It's a plain chat layout with too much whitespace for my taste. You know what's beautiful? A chat that I can theme and customize to match my definition of beautiful. This one doesn't even meet the minimum requirement of not being trapped in a browser. I want working keyboard shortcuts, I want detachable windows, and I want to copy/paste properly (browser chats give a garbled mess because your fancy CSS layout does not survive the process).

samstave 14y ago

I KNEW IT! I saw this UI and immediately recalled the ebook. I bought the ebook and reviewed it on HN. I thought the design was beautiful and elegant. This is GREAT to see it in a live app.