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It is not about what America has or hasn't done, good or bad, but all about the possibility of Trump. The idea of the US getting a president as immature as your

by Lutger 3y ago

It is not about what America has or hasn't done, good or bad, but all about the possibility of Trump. The idea of the US getting a president as immature as yourself, who rather aligns himself with the gangsters of the world, whose idea of diplomacy is beg-for-mercy-who-is-your-daddy-now oneliners, that is what scares Europa into self-reliance. Since Trump, the US might not be the US anymore in the future. It might break its promises, withdraw from NATO, from Paris and any other treaty it has made. War is coming closer to us, we cannot rely on a US that is actively flirting with authoritarianism. Hopefully not, but it is a very real possibility. And we are not ready for it.

cooper_ganglia 3y ago
I didn’t like him as president, but he was entirely right about that. Any president would be, regardless of their politics. As bluntly as possible: Keep your promises, and we will keep ours. But if you fail to keep yours, I do not believe we have any obligation to fulfill ours, even if it leads to loss of life. That’s not immaturity, that is the most basic, foundational tenets of a pact. Europe constantly fails to meet the requirements across multiple agreements, wether that’s defense spending, carbon emissions, or whatever else, but the second that the U.S. slightly slows down on handing out free cash to anyone who asks, we are a horrible, evil “mafia” country. It would be laughable if it weren’t so depressing. Ironically, more countries in NATO are meeting their 2% defense spending bill than ever before, because of a possible Trump presidency on the horizon. They know there’s a chance US funding gets rug-pulled, so they’re actually taking their defense spending seriously. Precisely because he is a poor, unpredictable leader, a Trump presidency is ironically what will save Europe from themselves.
- Lutger 3y ago
  The problem with Trump is the same as with your post: you don't even know what you're talking about. The 2 percent was agreed on only in 2014 as a response to Russian annexation of Crimea, and the goal was to reach it in 10 years, which we now have collectively as NATO. 18 members spend 2% or more, and the pressure is on for the rest. Do they have some explaining to do? Of course. But this is not a reason to threaten military allies of more than 70 years by saying Russia can invade them with impunity. Its like I'm a week late on a payment and the landlord promises to send a pack of mobsters to kick me out if I don't pony up the next day. Let's not talk about the emissions that is absolutely insane coming from the worst offender by far. Now the GOP is going to block the 'slight' spend of 60 billion in aid because it is using Ukraine as a bargaining chip for its anti-immigrant policies. This is about Trump, but beyond him the US might become a very unreliable and chaotic partner. I'm worried this will backfire. If it does, on the long term, China will start to look a lot more interesting to some European countries as a force of stability.

by Lutger 3y ago

cooper_ganglia 3y ago

I didn’t like him as president, but he was entirely right about that. Any president would be, regardless of their politics. As bluntly as possible: Keep your promises, and we will keep ours. But if you fail to keep yours, I do not believe we have any obligation to fulfill ours, even if it leads to loss of life. That’s not immaturity, that is the most basic, foundational tenets of a pact. Europe constantly fails to meet the requirements across multiple agreements, wether that’s defense spending, carbon emissions, or whatever else, but the second that the U.S. slightly slows down on handing out free cash to anyone who asks, we are a horrible, evil “mafia” country. It would be laughable if it weren’t so depressing. Ironically, more countries in NATO are meeting their 2% defense spending bill than ever before, because of a possible Trump presidency on the horizon. They know there’s a chance US funding gets rug-pulled, so they’re actually taking their defense spending seriously. Precisely because he is a poor, unpredictable leader, a Trump presidency is ironically what will save Europe from themselves.

Lutger 3y ago
The problem with Trump is the same as with your post: you don't even know what you're talking about. The 2 percent was agreed on only in 2014 as a response to Russian annexation of Crimea, and the goal was to reach it in 10 years, which we now have collectively as NATO. 18 members spend 2% or more, and the pressure is on for the rest. Do they have some explaining to do? Of course. But this is not a reason to threaten military allies of more than 70 years by saying Russia can invade them with impunity. Its like I'm a week late on a payment and the landlord promises to send a pack of mobsters to kick me out if I don't pony up the next day. Let's not talk about the emissions that is absolutely insane coming from the worst offender by far. Now the GOP is going to block the 'slight' spend of 60 billion in aid because it is using Ukraine as a bargaining chip for its anti-immigrant policies. This is about Trump, but beyond him the US might become a very unreliable and chaotic partner. I'm worried this will backfire. If it does, on the long term, China will start to look a lot more interesting to some European countries as a force of stability.