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That seems like a perfectly reasonable argument on the merits. What user actually needs web apps? What's the market for apps whose developers can't stomach a $9

That seems like a perfectly reasonable argument on the merits. What user actually needs web apps? What's the market for apps whose developers can't stomach a $99 developer fee and/or with functionality not allowable by app review?

breather 3y ago
Well shit, what user needs an app store to begin with? It was never about need, it was about what they could convince users to put up with.
- robertlagrant 3y ago
  Why do you think an app store isn't something people want, rather than something they put up with? What about the pre-app store world made it the one preferred by consumers in your mind?
  - smoldesu 3y ago
    > Why do you think an app store isn't something people want, rather than something they put up with? Because it seems to be that way on MacOS. On Mac, the App Store is absolutely useless and exclusively something people do not want. It does not distribute the software users want, it charges them extra fees, and limits the type of app you distribute. Judging by every single professional Mac user I've met, circumventing the App Store is a functional necessity for some. Most of them absolutely "put up with" the limitations and issues of MacOS. > What about the pre-app store world made it the one preferred by consumers in your mind? The freedom? The cheaper software? The stronger OS security models and lack of social-manipulation-as-a-security-feature? If the post-App Store world is so great, people will keep living in it even when alternative stores exist. I suspect that most users will not give a rats ass about convenience if there's a 30% cheaper subscription elsewhere.
    - robertlagrant 3y ago
      > If the post-App Store world is so great, people will keep living in it even when alternative stores exist Bear in mind I'm replying to someone who's saying app stores aren't necessary in general: > Well shit, what user needs an app store to begin with
      - smoldesu 3y ago
        In a reductive sense, they're right. Computers existed for upwards of three decades without App Stores, and we distributed software just fine without 'em. Apple could sign software the same way they do on Mac and effectively turn the App Store into an IPA-downloading PWA.
- shuckles 3y ago
  One user saying they don't need apps outside the App Store is an anecdote. Every person you ask about this matter over years saying they don't need apps outside the App Store is data.
pompino 3y ago
I hope you realize the irony that this just your personal view on what is reasonable and what is or isn't a merit. I don't see the point in bullying someone who is simply expressing an opinion - which happens to be anti-Apple - and one which makes a lot of sense to me.
- shuckles 3y ago
  Can you point out what I said that could be described as "bullying"?
basil-rash 3y ago
I made a web app that I use which makes use of the Web Push feature for timely notifications. Why should I pay Apple 99/year to get my own notifications on my own phone?

breather 3y ago

Well shit, what user needs an app store to begin with? It was never about need, it was about what they could convince users to put up with.

robertlagrant 3y ago
Why do you think an app store isn't something people want, rather than something they put up with? What about the pre-app store world made it the one preferred by consumers in your mind?
- smoldesu 3y ago
  > Why do you think an app store isn't something people want, rather than something they put up with? Because it seems to be that way on MacOS. On Mac, the App Store is absolutely useless and exclusively something people do not want. It does not distribute the software users want, it charges them extra fees, and limits the type of app you distribute. Judging by every single professional Mac user I've met, circumventing the App Store is a functional necessity for some. Most of them absolutely "put up with" the limitations and issues of MacOS. > What about the pre-app store world made it the one preferred by consumers in your mind? The freedom? The cheaper software? The stronger OS security models and lack of social-manipulation-as-a-security-feature? If the post-App Store world is so great, people will keep living in it even when alternative stores exist. I suspect that most users will not give a rats ass about convenience if there's a 30% cheaper subscription elsewhere.
  - robertlagrant 3y ago
    > If the post-App Store world is so great, people will keep living in it even when alternative stores exist Bear in mind I'm replying to someone who's saying app stores aren't necessary in general: > Well shit, what user needs an app store to begin with
    - smoldesu 3y ago
      In a reductive sense, they're right. Computers existed for upwards of three decades without App Stores, and we distributed software just fine without 'em. Apple could sign software the same way they do on Mac and effectively turn the App Store into an IPA-downloading PWA.
shuckles 3y ago
One user saying they don't need apps outside the App Store is an anecdote. Every person you ask about this matter over years saying they don't need apps outside the App Store is data.

pompino 3y ago

I hope you realize the irony that this just your personal view on what is reasonable and what is or isn't a merit. I don't see the point in bullying someone who is simply expressing an opinion - which happens to be anti-Apple - and one which makes a lot of sense to me.

shuckles 3y ago
Can you point out what I said that could be described as "bullying"?

basil-rash 3y ago

I made a web app that I use which makes use of the Web Push feature for timely notifications. Why should I pay Apple 99/year to get my own notifications on my own phone?