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After over a decade of mismanagement and missed opportunities from successive governments of the conservative party this is hardly surprising. The UK doesn't l

After over a decade of mismanagement and missed opportunities from successive governments of the conservative party this is hardly surprising. The UK doesn't look like it's going to rebound for many years, there are now significant structural issues, not least of them being poor infrastructure. I found this analysis of the UK particularly interesting: https://www.sambowman.co/p/democracy-is-the-solution-to-vetocracy https://www.sambowman.co/p/democracy-is-the-solution-to-veto...

mytailorisrich 3y ago
Can't blame them for the 2008 financial crisis, or even for Covid, though... and don't worry, the opposition is not better, judging by their plans (or lack thereof...). They'll most likely be in government by the end of this year, though. Fun times ahead. Edit: The bulk of the 2008 crisis was handled by the previous, Labour government and the conservatives inherited the debts to deal with. I'm not saying that handling of Covid was good, but looking at other countries it was certainly in the average (and the UK government decisively intervened to secure a domestic vaccine). The thing is that they've been in government for very long so have run out of talents and are obviously being blamed for everything. Many young people have never known anything else so of course they are the bad guys (on top of young people being on average more to the left). This is an eternal cycle and the same will eventually happen to the next Labour majority. Now, that's the issue Labour have: They have it easy at the moment, it's all the Tories' fault, the Tories are incompetent, etc. Fine, but at some point they will need an actual plan if only because, again, they'll most likely be in charge within months. Even Brexit is not exclusively the Conservatives' "fault": The Labour party and electorate were also highly divided on the issue and it was the Labour government of the time that decided against all restrictions to East European immigration in 2004. And I remember how popular they were when they obediently followed the US in Iraq... Labour even had a good shot as being elected earlier but made themselves unelectable by going far left, and they are still grappling with that.
- SideburnsOfDoom 3y ago
  > Can't blame them for the 2008 financial crisis, or even for Covid There is plenty of blame on the current UK government for how they handled the COVID crisis. It even forced out a Prime Minister, albeit for reasons of clandestine office parties, not over casualty rates or PPE corruption scandals.
- PlutoIsAPlanet 3y ago
  The 2008 financial crisis would of probably happened regardless of who was in number 10. However it did factor in the amount of deaths caused by COVID.
- ben_w 3y ago
  > Can't blame them for the 2008 financial crisis, or even for Covid, though For their mere existence? No. But they absolutely deserve blame them for how they handled these things, given they affected almost every nation on the planet, many of whom handled each rather better.
- Lio 3y ago
  No but I can blame them for profiteering during covid. Michelle Mone clearly wasn't the only one punting over-priced, poor quality PPE via the special Tory VIP system. Cumulatively, how much have Tory VIPs taken out of the economy since they came to power? Even Sunak seems to be in on it. Like the wink-wink "you outsource your IT services to Infosys and we give you new sweetheart oil contracts" deal that BP and Shell got. I think we have a right to be angry about this. It's corruption.
  - ilikerashers 3y ago
    The Michelle Mone story is insane. Her husband sold illegal tax schemes to IT contractors and escaped without serious repercussions. UK government is outsourcing everything and it's not just Infosys. They set low salary levels and flooded the market with offshore devs in the last few years.
    - pjc50 3y ago
      > The Michelle Mone story is insane. Her husband sold illegal tax schemes to IT contractors and escaped without serious repercussions. And she got a peerage out of it! Presumably by knowing the right people and paying them.
- andyjohnson0 3y ago
  > Can't blame them for the 2008 financial crisis, Neither the Labour govt of the time or the Conservative ones we've had since 2010 were immediately responsible. But the austerity policy pursued by the Tories since 2010 has put the country in an economic death spiral. Pre-gfc levels of education, health and social care, law and order, infrastructure and defence provision are now basically impossible for the country to sustain. I don't see any way back from this in a timescale that doesn't condem my children's generation to poverty and disadvantage. (And if the gfc was caused by a failure of regulation then every uk government since 1979 bears some culpability for its failure to supervise a major financial market centre.)
- acallaghan 3y ago
  If Corbyn has been PM and had been quoted as saying "Let the bodies pile high in streets" do you think you'd still think he had no impact on Covid?
TheOtherHobbes 3y ago
The structural issues are wholly captive media, a non-representative electoral system, and feudal traditions of greed and contempt for the lower orders - which used to mean contempt for the working classes, but has recently been extended to doctors and lawyers. Much to their surprise. The UK has literally become one of those third-world countries where oligarchs buy yachts and fast cars while the population starves.
- marcosscriven 3y ago
  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CVbCY51iz1k&t=646s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CVbCY51iz1k&t=646s
- eynsham 3y ago
  > wholly captive media Who exactly has captured The Guardian, The Times, the Daily Mail, the Financial Times, the London Review of Books, and the BBC all at the same time? > a non-representative electoral system that can symmetrically benefit either side. > feudal traditions of greed and contempt for the lower classes…extended to doctors and lawyers You can just look these things up: https://researchbriefings.files.parliament.uk/documents/CBP-7483/CBP-7483.pdf https://researchbriefings.files.parliament.uk/documents/CBP-.... Doctors and lawyers are still overrepresented. The class background of the new sort of Tory (Williamson, Dorries, Jenkyns) is hardly more aristocratic than the members of the professions that preceded them, even if some receive honours. > The UK has literally become one of those third-world countries where oligarchs buy yachts and fast cars while the population starves. This describes pretty much any moderately wealthy country in which hunger still exists. The situation might well be worse in the UK but to show that would require use of such difficult techniques as counting and research, rather than hackneyed repetition of old stereotypes.
  - pjc50 3y ago
    Previous comment's "contempt for the working classes, but has recently been extended to doctors and lawyers" referred to public sector pay rather than party composition. (There is a huge backlog in the courts system and defence barristers are very under-funded, making the problem worse)

mytailorisrich 3y ago

Can't blame them for the 2008 financial crisis, or even for Covid, though... and don't worry, the opposition is not better, judging by their plans (or lack thereof...). They'll most likely be in government by the end of this year, though. Fun times ahead. Edit: The bulk of the 2008 crisis was handled by the previous, Labour government and the conservatives inherited the debts to deal with. I'm not saying that handling of Covid was good, but looking at other countries it was certainly in the average (and the UK government decisively intervened to secure a domestic vaccine). The thing is that they've been in government for very long so have run out of talents and are obviously being blamed for everything. Many young people have never known anything else so of course they are the bad guys (on top of young people being on average more to the left). This is an eternal cycle and the same will eventually happen to the next Labour majority. Now, that's the issue Labour have: They have it easy at the moment, it's all the Tories' fault, the Tories are incompetent, etc. Fine, but at some point they will need an actual plan if only because, again, they'll most likely be in charge within months. Even Brexit is not exclusively the Conservatives' "fault": The Labour party and electorate were also highly divided on the issue and it was the Labour government of the time that decided against all restrictions to East European immigration in 2004. And I remember how popular they were when they obediently followed the US in Iraq... Labour even had a good shot as being elected earlier but made themselves unelectable by going far left, and they are still grappling with that.

SideburnsOfDoom 3y ago
> Can't blame them for the 2008 financial crisis, or even for Covid There is plenty of blame on the current UK government for how they handled the COVID crisis. It even forced out a Prime Minister, albeit for reasons of clandestine office parties, not over casualty rates or PPE corruption scandals.
PlutoIsAPlanet 3y ago
The 2008 financial crisis would of probably happened regardless of who was in number 10. However it did factor in the amount of deaths caused by COVID.
ben_w 3y ago
> Can't blame them for the 2008 financial crisis, or even for Covid, though For their mere existence? No. But they absolutely deserve blame them for how they handled these things, given they affected almost every nation on the planet, many of whom handled each rather better.
Lio 3y ago
No but I can blame them for profiteering during covid. Michelle Mone clearly wasn't the only one punting over-priced, poor quality PPE via the special Tory VIP system. Cumulatively, how much have Tory VIPs taken out of the economy since they came to power? Even Sunak seems to be in on it. Like the wink-wink "you outsource your IT services to Infosys and we give you new sweetheart oil contracts" deal that BP and Shell got. I think we have a right to be angry about this. It's corruption.
- ilikerashers 3y ago
  The Michelle Mone story is insane. Her husband sold illegal tax schemes to IT contractors and escaped without serious repercussions. UK government is outsourcing everything and it's not just Infosys. They set low salary levels and flooded the market with offshore devs in the last few years.
  - pjc50 3y ago
    > The Michelle Mone story is insane. Her husband sold illegal tax schemes to IT contractors and escaped without serious repercussions. And she got a peerage out of it! Presumably by knowing the right people and paying them.
andyjohnson0 3y ago
> Can't blame them for the 2008 financial crisis, Neither the Labour govt of the time or the Conservative ones we've had since 2010 were immediately responsible. But the austerity policy pursued by the Tories since 2010 has put the country in an economic death spiral. Pre-gfc levels of education, health and social care, law and order, infrastructure and defence provision are now basically impossible for the country to sustain. I don't see any way back from this in a timescale that doesn't condem my children's generation to poverty and disadvantage. (And if the gfc was caused by a failure of regulation then every uk government since 1979 bears some culpability for its failure to supervise a major financial market centre.)
acallaghan 3y ago
If Corbyn has been PM and had been quoted as saying "Let the bodies pile high in streets" do you think you'd still think he had no impact on Covid?

TheOtherHobbes 3y ago

The structural issues are wholly captive media, a non-representative electoral system, and feudal traditions of greed and contempt for the lower orders - which used to mean contempt for the working classes, but has recently been extended to doctors and lawyers. Much to their surprise. The UK has literally become one of those third-world countries where oligarchs buy yachts and fast cars while the population starves.

marcosscriven 3y ago
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CVbCY51iz1k&t=646s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CVbCY51iz1k&t=646s
eynsham 3y ago
> wholly captive media Who exactly has captured The Guardian, The Times, the Daily Mail, the Financial Times, the London Review of Books, and the BBC all at the same time? > a non-representative electoral system that can symmetrically benefit either side. > feudal traditions of greed and contempt for the lower classes…extended to doctors and lawyers You can just look these things up: https://researchbriefings.files.parliament.uk/documents/CBP-7483/CBP-7483.pdf https://researchbriefings.files.parliament.uk/documents/CBP-.... Doctors and lawyers are still overrepresented. The class background of the new sort of Tory (Williamson, Dorries, Jenkyns) is hardly more aristocratic than the members of the professions that preceded them, even if some receive honours. > The UK has literally become one of those third-world countries where oligarchs buy yachts and fast cars while the population starves. This describes pretty much any moderately wealthy country in which hunger still exists. The situation might well be worse in the UK but to show that would require use of such difficult techniques as counting and research, rather than hackneyed repetition of old stereotypes.
- pjc50 3y ago
  Previous comment's "contempt for the working classes, but has recently been extended to doctors and lawyers" referred to public sector pay rather than party composition. (There is a huge backlog in the courts system and defence barristers are very under-funded, making the problem worse)