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Data point: after being physically attacked in the street by a (presumably) homeless man, the SF cops refused to take my report unless I went down to the statio

Data point: after being physically attacked in the street by a (presumably) homeless man, the SF cops refused to take my report unless I went down to the station. I'd regard these statistics as, very generously, aspirational.

ajross 3y ago
The point is obviously that crime has dropped sharply over the past two years, not that it doesn't exist. Were they taking reports over the phone in 2021, before the recent sharp drop? (Also: I guess I don't understand your demand here? A police report is testimony. The officer needs to verify your identity, record what you said, and do so in a standard and traceable way. It's not like "there's an app for that", if you want to deal with law enforcement you have to do it in person.)
- scarmig 3y ago
  "The user is wrong" is not a way to justify bad statistics. Saying a violent assault doesn't count as a violent assault unless the victim is willing to spend god knows how many hours going through bureaucracy purely for the sake of bureaucracy (no one would be investigated or punished, regardless) is off-base. It makes sense to have a reasonable set of barriers if you're talking about making sure evidence would stand up in trial. That same set of barriers, however, makes the statistics understate the true crime level. "The officer needs to verify your identity, record what you said, and do so in a standard and traceable way" makes sense for trial, but at the same time it would cause an understatement in crime. Particularly for marginalized groups (of which I'm not part, at least for the sake of this discussion) e.g. undocumented immigrants, rape victims, people who don't have time to go through the process because they have to spend every waking hour trying to survive. I have no opinion on whether underreporting is higher or lower than it was five years ago. It's genuinely impossible to say, without a secondary, more reliable measure (beyond anecdotes). Someone stole my laundry in 2015, and SFPD also weren't interested in me reporting that.

ajross 3y ago

The point is obviously that crime has dropped sharply over the past two years, not that it doesn't exist. Were they taking reports over the phone in 2021, before the recent sharp drop? (Also: I guess I don't understand your demand here? A police report is testimony. The officer needs to verify your identity, record what you said, and do so in a standard and traceable way. It's not like "there's an app for that", if you want to deal with law enforcement you have to do it in person.)

scarmig 3y ago
"The user is wrong" is not a way to justify bad statistics. Saying a violent assault doesn't count as a violent assault unless the victim is willing to spend god knows how many hours going through bureaucracy purely for the sake of bureaucracy (no one would be investigated or punished, regardless) is off-base. It makes sense to have a reasonable set of barriers if you're talking about making sure evidence would stand up in trial. That same set of barriers, however, makes the statistics understate the true crime level. "The officer needs to verify your identity, record what you said, and do so in a standard and traceable way" makes sense for trial, but at the same time it would cause an understatement in crime. Particularly for marginalized groups (of which I'm not part, at least for the sake of this discussion) e.g. undocumented immigrants, rape victims, people who don't have time to go through the process because they have to spend every waking hour trying to survive. I have no opinion on whether underreporting is higher or lower than it was five years ago. It's genuinely impossible to say, without a secondary, more reliable measure (beyond anecdotes). Someone stole my laundry in 2015, and SFPD also weren't interested in me reporting that.