4 ms·

I've wanted one of these since release but couldn't quite stomach the $1400 price of entry as the synthesizer part of it - while very full featured - isn't the

I've wanted one of these since release but couldn't quite stomach the $1400 price of entry as the synthesizer part of it - while very full featured - isn't the real use case at a Prosumer-Level and is a needless addition for me. Like most users who drop that kind of money on outboard, all I really wanted here was the 8x16 Sequencer/Sampler for controlling my CV and MIDI synths and drum machines, at maybe a $500-600 pricepoint. There are plenty of far cheaper 'grooveboxes' for DAW-less fun like the cheaper Roland TR range for those who want instant gratification, and even premium offerings like Teenage Engineering have. Still, I'm very glad this exists.

pantulis 3y ago
In terms of MIDI grooveboxes, I see Polyend Tracker and Square Hapax are interesting, but they are not cheap either.
- piltdownman 3y ago
  Yeah that's the problem with all these boutique sequencer stuff - out of the DAW live performance is tricky unless you buy into the Elektron ecosystem which I don't as a mostly analog purist. As a result I've cheaped out and when not using my beatstep to control the stuff via my DAW I have a Korg SQ64 but its a bit unintuitive flow-wise in terms of live jamming. I end up just using my TR-8S with the 2600 or 303 side-chained through it.
  - sonjaqql 3y ago
    The Arturia Beatstep Pro has been the only sequencer I’ve connected with for my modest gate, cv, and midi sync needs. I moved to it after scoring what I thought was a deal on a SQ64. I really wish the SQ64 felt like a playable instrument and didn’t come out of the box with noise issues.
    - misterbishop 3y ago
      SQ64 is such a mess. My worst gear purchase.
  - munificent 3y ago
    > unless you buy into the Elektron ecosystem which I don't as a mostly analog purist. Analog 4, Analog Heat, Analog Rytm...
    - piltdownman 3y ago
      No you're right, they've some competitive analog offerings nowadays which I keep forgetting about. Headspace wise I'm still stuck at the last time I was properly 'shopping' for gear when the Elektron holy trinity was Syntakt, Digitakt and Digitone.
      - munificent 3y ago
        The Syntakt also has multiple analog oscillators, analog noise, and analog drive in it.
- zoklet-enjoyer 3y ago
  I've had the Tracker for a while and it's really fun and easy to get a hang of. I haven't tried it as a MIDI sequencer and kind of forgot that that's even an option. It's a fun toy when I'm laying on the couch after work
  - pantulis 3y ago
    Sorry, I meant to say the Polyend Play! Not sure if Tracker has MIDI out capabilities.
112233 3y ago
PSA: launchpad-pro has official SDK
- piltdownman 3y ago
  I've been a Novation fan since the Nova (and even stuck with them through their dodgy 2000s VA phase with things like the X-Station) but the launchpad-pro is crucially missing CV outputs for controlling my semi-modular stuff. Ableton Push 3 allows you to send four CV signals using the footswitch jacks, and for roughly the same price as the Deluge I'd probably go for that given its value proposition: a full i3-1115G4 processor w/ 8GB of RAM and over 2 hours battery life, plus native audio interface.
  - 112233 3y ago
    I always wonder about CV — how much is voltage drop due to cables and connections? Is there a measurable detuning? (I'd love if there was a cheap digital version of patching using e.g. I2S and with 1 sample delay per node, but no such thing.. )
liotier 3y ago
> There are plenty of far cheaper 'grooveboxes' for DAW-less fun On the price/features criteria, I believe the Akai MPC One remains supreme. Others are superior in some areas, but as a versatile "do-it-all box" it is astonishing value for 700€. Yes, a DAW has the same ability for less money (not including the computer one may already possess), but the ergonomics are a major part of what makes those Linux boxes feel like a music instrument.
- misterbishop 3y ago
  MPC One/Live/X is an incredible platform. I would like to build an open source alternative.
  - liotier 3y ago
    An open source MPC ? Take a look at Zynthian ! Not much cheaper than an MPC One, but totally open source and leverages a ton of existing Linux music software... You might be interested if you feel frustrated by Akai's control of the MPC platform, are willing to exchange maturity for freedom of integration, and still want solid dedicated hardware. https://zynthian.org/ https://zynthian.org/
dijksterhuis 3y ago
> couldn't quite stomach the $1400 looks at my elektron gear sheepishly
- piltdownman 3y ago
  I've gone through stupid amounts of GAS in my time. With my current Behringer Pro-1/MS-20/Neutron Tower, their 303 and 2600 clones, a microbrute, a Triton 61 etc... I've more or less fleshed out my ideal hands-on rig. If I'm dropping 4 figures on something at this point it would have to be a Prophet-6 - and that's end-game territory. Although saying that, I'd imagine I could get very easily into Eventide FX outboard if I let myself lol
doctorpangloss 3y ago
> $1400 price of entry as the synthesizer part of it That's what's special about the "audio" category though. People's brains turn off. The price of an iPhone 14 Max! But maybe it lets you tap into those latent feelings, "What would it have been like if I had gone to Eastman?" > premium offerings like Teenage Engineering have They have like 4/30 non-audio products. Look at them, and feel the magic evaporate. I can only speak to their SFF PC case, it is notoriously bad. Of course their stuff is beautiful, but so are Braun watches, Hay furniture, etc. I am not sure what these product categories tap into emotionally that phones haven't figured out how to yet.
helpfulContrib 3y ago
[dead]
blehn 3y ago
It's wild to me that there's still no dedicated hardware MIDI sequencer that's designed for making _songs_. Pretty much everything is designed for making lots of 16 step patterns. But then arranging those patterns is a mystery. I had the deluge and it's not great. The Roland TR-8S inexplicable has no song mode. The Squarp hapax seems close but has some serious flaws from what I've read. Ultimately using a DAW still wins.
- piltdownman 3y ago
  Yeah the TR-8S is very much geared as a live performance device to channel your inner-Jeff Mills (even though the 909/808 did have a song mode!). I will say you can get most of the way there with pattern chaining, and you implement a more fully featured ersatz song mode if you have something that will send it MIDI ProgramChange messages. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P01V0I84P8k https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P01V0I84P8k

pantulis 3y ago

In terms of MIDI grooveboxes, I see Polyend Tracker and Square Hapax are interesting, but they are not cheap either.

piltdownman 3y ago
Yeah that's the problem with all these boutique sequencer stuff - out of the DAW live performance is tricky unless you buy into the Elektron ecosystem which I don't as a mostly analog purist. As a result I've cheaped out and when not using my beatstep to control the stuff via my DAW I have a Korg SQ64 but its a bit unintuitive flow-wise in terms of live jamming. I end up just using my TR-8S with the 2600 or 303 side-chained through it.
- sonjaqql 3y ago
  The Arturia Beatstep Pro has been the only sequencer I’ve connected with for my modest gate, cv, and midi sync needs. I moved to it after scoring what I thought was a deal on a SQ64. I really wish the SQ64 felt like a playable instrument and didn’t come out of the box with noise issues.
  - misterbishop 3y ago
    SQ64 is such a mess. My worst gear purchase.
- munificent 3y ago
  > unless you buy into the Elektron ecosystem which I don't as a mostly analog purist. Analog 4, Analog Heat, Analog Rytm...
  - piltdownman 3y ago
    No you're right, they've some competitive analog offerings nowadays which I keep forgetting about. Headspace wise I'm still stuck at the last time I was properly 'shopping' for gear when the Elektron holy trinity was Syntakt, Digitakt and Digitone.
    - munificent 3y ago
      The Syntakt also has multiple analog oscillators, analog noise, and analog drive in it.
zoklet-enjoyer 3y ago
I've had the Tracker for a while and it's really fun and easy to get a hang of. I haven't tried it as a MIDI sequencer and kind of forgot that that's even an option. It's a fun toy when I'm laying on the couch after work
- pantulis 3y ago
  Sorry, I meant to say the Polyend Play! Not sure if Tracker has MIDI out capabilities.

112233 3y ago

PSA: launchpad-pro has official SDK

piltdownman 3y ago
I've been a Novation fan since the Nova (and even stuck with them through their dodgy 2000s VA phase with things like the X-Station) but the launchpad-pro is crucially missing CV outputs for controlling my semi-modular stuff. Ableton Push 3 allows you to send four CV signals using the footswitch jacks, and for roughly the same price as the Deluge I'd probably go for that given its value proposition: a full i3-1115G4 processor w/ 8GB of RAM and over 2 hours battery life, plus native audio interface.
- 112233 3y ago
  I always wonder about CV — how much is voltage drop due to cables and connections? Is there a measurable detuning? (I'd love if there was a cheap digital version of patching using e.g. I2S and with 1 sample delay per node, but no such thing.. )

liotier 3y ago

> There are plenty of far cheaper 'grooveboxes' for DAW-less fun On the price/features criteria, I believe the Akai MPC One remains supreme. Others are superior in some areas, but as a versatile "do-it-all box" it is astonishing value for 700€. Yes, a DAW has the same ability for less money (not including the computer one may already possess), but the ergonomics are a major part of what makes those Linux boxes feel like a music instrument.

misterbishop 3y ago
MPC One/Live/X is an incredible platform. I would like to build an open source alternative.
- liotier 3y ago
  An open source MPC ? Take a look at Zynthian ! Not much cheaper than an MPC One, but totally open source and leverages a ton of existing Linux music software... You might be interested if you feel frustrated by Akai's control of the MPC platform, are willing to exchange maturity for freedom of integration, and still want solid dedicated hardware. https://zynthian.org/ https://zynthian.org/

dijksterhuis 3y ago

> couldn't quite stomach the $1400 looks at my elektron gear sheepishly

piltdownman 3y ago
I've gone through stupid amounts of GAS in my time. With my current Behringer Pro-1/MS-20/Neutron Tower, their 303 and 2600 clones, a microbrute, a Triton 61 etc... I've more or less fleshed out my ideal hands-on rig. If I'm dropping 4 figures on something at this point it would have to be a Prophet-6 - and that's end-game territory. Although saying that, I'd imagine I could get very easily into Eventide FX outboard if I let myself lol

doctorpangloss 3y ago

> $1400 price of entry as the synthesizer part of it That's what's special about the "audio" category though. People's brains turn off. The price of an iPhone 14 Max! But maybe it lets you tap into those latent feelings, "What would it have been like if I had gone to Eastman?" > premium offerings like Teenage Engineering have They have like 4/30 non-audio products. Look at them, and feel the magic evaporate. I can only speak to their SFF PC case, it is notoriously bad. Of course their stuff is beautiful, but so are Braun watches, Hay furniture, etc. I am not sure what these product categories tap into emotionally that phones haven't figured out how to yet.

helpfulContrib 3y ago

[dead]

blehn 3y ago

It's wild to me that there's still no dedicated hardware MIDI sequencer that's designed for making _songs_. Pretty much everything is designed for making lots of 16 step patterns. But then arranging those patterns is a mystery. I had the deluge and it's not great. The Roland TR-8S inexplicable has no song mode. The Squarp hapax seems close but has some serious flaws from what I've read. Ultimately using a DAW still wins.

piltdownman 3y ago
Yeah the TR-8S is very much geared as a live performance device to channel your inner-Jeff Mills (even though the 909/808 did have a song mode!). I will say you can get most of the way there with pattern chaining, and you implement a more fully featured ersatz song mode if you have something that will send it MIDI ProgramChange messages. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P01V0I84P8k https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P01V0I84P8k