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I kept cringing when I read the words “no bugs.” This is hubris in the classic style - it’s asking for a literal thunderbolt from the heavens. It may be true,

I kept cringing when I read the words “no bugs.” This is hubris in the classic style - it’s asking for a literal thunderbolt from the heavens. It may be true, but…come on. Everyone who has ever written a program has thought they were done only to find one more bug. It’s the fundamental experience of programming to asymptotically approach zero bugs but never actually get there. Again, perhaps the claim is true but it goes against my instincts to entertain the possibility.

rkangel 3y ago
I think there is something interesting about the fact that someone writing "no bugs" makes us all uncomfortable. If they really did have a complex product, running in production from a sizeable userbase and had 2 bug reports ever, then I think it's a reasonable thing to say. The fact that it isn't a reasonable thing to say for the most other software is a little sad.
- shermantanktop 3y ago
  Right, the claim may be true, but I have a visceral reaction to it. And tbh I'd be hesitant to work with someone who made a zero-bugs claim about their own work.
sfink 3y ago
Yeah, same. It suggests that you must be employing one of the time-honored approaches to getting zero bugs: * Redefine all bugs as features * Redefine "bug" to conveniently only apply to the things your system prevents * Don't write software This reminds me of bugzilla's "Zarro Boogs" phrase that pointedly avoids saying "Zero Bugs" because it's such a deceptive term, see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bugzilla https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bugzilla Being able to say "no bugs" with justifiable confidence, even when restricting it to some class of bugs, is truly a great and significant thing. cf Rust. But claiming to have no bugs is cringeworthy.
chinchilla2020 3y ago
It's a marketing blog post, not a technical post. Something about the whole thing feels icky.
deterministic 3y ago
Nope. CompCert is an example of software that was mostly proven correct (all the important stuff) and zero bugs have ever been found in the proven correct parts. So yes you can indeed write zero bugs software.

rkangel 3y ago

I think there is something interesting about the fact that someone writing "no bugs" makes us all uncomfortable. If they really did have a complex product, running in production from a sizeable userbase and had 2 bug reports ever, then I think it's a reasonable thing to say. The fact that it isn't a reasonable thing to say for the most other software is a little sad.

shermantanktop 3y ago
Right, the claim may be true, but I have a visceral reaction to it. And tbh I'd be hesitant to work with someone who made a zero-bugs claim about their own work.

sfink 3y ago

Yeah, same. It suggests that you must be employing one of the time-honored approaches to getting zero bugs: * Redefine all bugs as features * Redefine "bug" to conveniently only apply to the things your system prevents * Don't write software This reminds me of bugzilla's "Zarro Boogs" phrase that pointedly avoids saying "Zero Bugs" because it's such a deceptive term, see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bugzilla https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bugzilla Being able to say "no bugs" with justifiable confidence, even when restricting it to some class of bugs, is truly a great and significant thing. cf Rust. But claiming to have no bugs is cringeworthy.

chinchilla2020 3y ago

It's a marketing blog post, not a technical post. Something about the whole thing feels icky.

deterministic 3y ago

Nope. CompCert is an example of software that was mostly proven correct (all the important stuff) and zero bugs have ever been found in the proven correct parts. So yes you can indeed write zero bugs software.