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> He would have to surrender a sum of taxpayer dollars that equaled five times the budget for education and 10 times the budget for public health. I can't imag

by sgu999 3y ago

> He would have to surrender a sum of taxpayer dollars that equaled five times the budget for education and 10 times the budget for public health. I can't imagine for a second the state of mind of someone who thinks that's OK as long as they can make money. That these Quinn and Cahill and the ones in London who arbitrated in their favour can be free, and very likely richer than most good people are, makes me loose all faith in our stupid civilisation.

alephnerd 3y ago
> I can't imagine for a second the state of mind of someone who thinks that's OK as long as they can make money. Devil's advocate, but they can rationalize it because the education and public health budget is anyhow going to be embezzled by some Minister (eg. the current Education Minister of Nigeria [0]) or local politician. The amount of rot and corruption in LDCs is insane, as governance and institutions are inherently rotten. The only solution in such an environment is to be corrupt like everyone else, and hope there are enough suckers motivated by ideals like "patriotism" or "responsibility" in order to continue managing development. This is why you see a brain drain from a number of LDCs - a lot of smart people don't want to live in that kind of an environment. It's very soul crushing. Edit: Devil's Advocate means I'm arguing for a position I am morally opposed to. This doesn't mean I support this kind of corruption. [0] - https://eng.fatshimetrie.org/2024/01/07/corruption-scandal-nigerias-education-minister-at-the-heart-of-embezzlement-of-education-funds/ https://eng.fatshimetrie.org/2024/01/07/corruption-scandal-n...
- r00fus 3y ago
  > Devil's advocate, but they can rationalize it because the education and public health budget is anyhow going to be embezzled by some Minister (eg. the current Education Minister of Nigeria [0]) or local politician. Yeah, the bullshit self-justification that "someone will steal it, it might as well be me" is definitely what any functioning society is ostensibly designed to handle (either to formalize it for autocracies or prevent it from disrupting for republics).
  - alephnerd 3y ago
    > is definitely what any functioning society is ostensibly designed to handle That's how I know you grew up in an Upper Middle Class American household. Newsflash - humans suck. America used to be this corrupt 50-60 years ago as well, but it required generational bipartisan reforms to change. You can't expect a county that's still in the economic equivalent of the 1910s-20s to speedrun generational legislative changes. Take a look at European countries like Poland, Hungary, Portugal, Greece, etc. They might be "developed" in the sense that there are shiny buildings and people aren't starving to death anymore, but wheeling and dealing, cronyism, and judicial+legislative tampering still occur. ----------- Also, view corruption as a feature, not a bug. In developing countries, you don't rule by ideology, you rule by pure unadulterated power. Before the internet, you could shoot someone in a ditch and it won't trend on Twitter or IG. Now it will, so the best solution to maintain compliance is to use corruption as a way to keep everyone in line - all politicians in these countries partake in it, but if they don't listen to leadership, they will be prosecuted for it.

by sgu999 3y ago

alephnerd 3y ago

> I can't imagine for a second the state of mind of someone who thinks that's OK as long as they can make money. Devil's advocate, but they can rationalize it because the education and public health budget is anyhow going to be embezzled by some Minister (eg. the current Education Minister of Nigeria [0]) or local politician. The amount of rot and corruption in LDCs is insane, as governance and institutions are inherently rotten. The only solution in such an environment is to be corrupt like everyone else, and hope there are enough suckers motivated by ideals like "patriotism" or "responsibility" in order to continue managing development. This is why you see a brain drain from a number of LDCs - a lot of smart people don't want to live in that kind of an environment. It's very soul crushing. Edit: Devil's Advocate means I'm arguing for a position I am morally opposed to. This doesn't mean I support this kind of corruption. [0] - https://eng.fatshimetrie.org/2024/01/07/corruption-scandal-nigerias-education-minister-at-the-heart-of-embezzlement-of-education-funds/ https://eng.fatshimetrie.org/2024/01/07/corruption-scandal-n...

r00fus 3y ago
> Devil's advocate, but they can rationalize it because the education and public health budget is anyhow going to be embezzled by some Minister (eg. the current Education Minister of Nigeria [0]) or local politician. Yeah, the bullshit self-justification that "someone will steal it, it might as well be me" is definitely what any functioning society is ostensibly designed to handle (either to formalize it for autocracies or prevent it from disrupting for republics).
- alephnerd 3y ago
  > is definitely what any functioning society is ostensibly designed to handle That's how I know you grew up in an Upper Middle Class American household. Newsflash - humans suck. America used to be this corrupt 50-60 years ago as well, but it required generational bipartisan reforms to change. You can't expect a county that's still in the economic equivalent of the 1910s-20s to speedrun generational legislative changes. Take a look at European countries like Poland, Hungary, Portugal, Greece, etc. They might be "developed" in the sense that there are shiny buildings and people aren't starving to death anymore, but wheeling and dealing, cronyism, and judicial+legislative tampering still occur. ----------- Also, view corruption as a feature, not a bug. In developing countries, you don't rule by ideology, you rule by pure unadulterated power. Before the internet, you could shoot someone in a ditch and it won't trend on Twitter or IG. Now it will, so the best solution to maintain compliance is to use corruption as a way to keep everyone in line - all politicians in these countries partake in it, but if they don't listen to leadership, they will be prosecuted for it.