3 ms·

There’s literally thousands of generations prior that have made someone’s life possible. And then they wash their hands of the matter and say “nope, I’m not gi

by aantix 3y ago

There’s literally thousands of generations prior that have made someone’s life possible. And then they wash their hands of the matter and say “nope, I’m not giving anyone else a chance at life. I’ll enjoy mine but it ends here”. That is selfishness.

defrost 3y ago
And yet there are more people alive now than there has ever been. Plenty of chances for a good life out there, more than ever. What is this bizarre obsession some have with endless growth? Why is it that having more and more people is so " essential"? How many billions are enough to stabilise at?
kalleboo 3y ago
What I hear from millennials is "life is suffering, our future is doomed (global warming, mass extinction, insane politics, increasing loneliness), why would I force some kid to have to grow up in this shit world just for my own fulfillment?"
- ekianjo 3y ago
  [flagged]
  - swells34 3y ago
    You mean, they've refused the delusion that previous generations utilized to do horrible damage to our planet and long term way of life?
- lupusreal 3y ago
  Media has them mind broke. The material conditions climate change / etc will inflict on them are nothing compared to the material conditions our ancestors endured before the creation of modern technology. "Boo hoo, the weather is shitty and some people are moving around because of it" he says, as he doesn't have to worry about Bubonic Plague or Genghis Khan.
  - ben_w 3y ago
    I wish people didn't mind people moving around, but (a) the UK gets worried about mere tens of thousands, and (b) "some people" in the case of climate-change induced changes to farming output would, with current economics, be "about three times the total population of Earth when the Black Death started".
- aantix 3y ago
  Which is crazy. Because no one had a life harder than the previous generations. The amount of technological progress in the past decade is staggering. So many infrastructure issues are now just automated, that we don’t have to think about. It’s a great time to be alive. And a great time to give someone else that opportunity to experience it too.
  - ben_w 3y ago
    Maaaaaybe. Looking at long term trends, the only single thing I can be sure of is the future won't look like the present. I am currently experiencing a strong drive to start a family. Lets say I get very lucky and cause a pregnancy tomorrow; kid comes out 9 months later, 21 years (± whatever for when school starts), they graduate university and… it's not predictable in the slightest. We might have single-atom transistors as standard, or the factories might be too expensive to mass produce them. We might have solved all genetic conditions, or research might have stalled with Moore's Law. AI might be good enough to make human labour uneconomical, which is a separate issue to if we will arrange our economies to make this a utopia or a dystopia, or it might not. Even without AI, internet connectivity and robotics is enough to make Amazon Mechanical Turk more like its namesake, with the same impact on cost-cutting and outsourcing to whoever has an internet connection. Genetics research, even if limited to no-growth-in-computing scenarios, may also make it affordable for small and dumb terrorist groups to attempt DIY genocides, and even if they fail at their goal that may still cause megadeaths… but we may well also have defences against it, either biological or surveillance. Similar issues for drones and high-powered lasers. We've already got government-affordable ways to put literally every human on the planet under 24/7 surveillance, and that's likely to get cheap enough for organised crime to automate blackmail, but we also already have people doing that with generative AI and the social responses (let alone the legislative) could be almost anything. 3D printed houses and boats are both realities now, will we finally witness large-scale seasteading, or is that fundamentally untenable? And that's all assuming no world-ending, or even just economy-ending, catastrophes of any kind — no paperclip optimisers, no nuclear wars, no peak-${insert-resource-here}, no environmental issues causing 1e9-scale migration.
maxdoop 3y ago
"I'm not giving anyone else a chance" -- there is no "anyone else". There is nothing being robbed, as there is no other party that literally exists in the universe.

by aantix 3y ago

defrost 3y ago

And yet there are more people alive now than there has ever been. Plenty of chances for a good life out there, more than ever. What is this bizarre obsession some have with endless growth? Why is it that having more and more people is so " essential"? How many billions are enough to stabilise at?

kalleboo 3y ago

What I hear from millennials is "life is suffering, our future is doomed (global warming, mass extinction, insane politics, increasing loneliness), why would I force some kid to have to grow up in this shit world just for my own fulfillment?"

ekianjo 3y ago
[flagged]
- swells34 3y ago
  You mean, they've refused the delusion that previous generations utilized to do horrible damage to our planet and long term way of life?
lupusreal 3y ago
Media has them mind broke. The material conditions climate change / etc will inflict on them are nothing compared to the material conditions our ancestors endured before the creation of modern technology. "Boo hoo, the weather is shitty and some people are moving around because of it" he says, as he doesn't have to worry about Bubonic Plague or Genghis Khan.
- ben_w 3y ago
  I wish people didn't mind people moving around, but (a) the UK gets worried about mere tens of thousands, and (b) "some people" in the case of climate-change induced changes to farming output would, with current economics, be "about three times the total population of Earth when the Black Death started".
aantix 3y ago
Which is crazy. Because no one had a life harder than the previous generations. The amount of technological progress in the past decade is staggering. So many infrastructure issues are now just automated, that we don’t have to think about. It’s a great time to be alive. And a great time to give someone else that opportunity to experience it too.
- ben_w 3y ago
  Maaaaaybe. Looking at long term trends, the only single thing I can be sure of is the future won't look like the present. I am currently experiencing a strong drive to start a family. Lets say I get very lucky and cause a pregnancy tomorrow; kid comes out 9 months later, 21 years (± whatever for when school starts), they graduate university and… it's not predictable in the slightest. We might have single-atom transistors as standard, or the factories might be too expensive to mass produce them. We might have solved all genetic conditions, or research might have stalled with Moore's Law. AI might be good enough to make human labour uneconomical, which is a separate issue to if we will arrange our economies to make this a utopia or a dystopia, or it might not. Even without AI, internet connectivity and robotics is enough to make Amazon Mechanical Turk more like its namesake, with the same impact on cost-cutting and outsourcing to whoever has an internet connection. Genetics research, even if limited to no-growth-in-computing scenarios, may also make it affordable for small and dumb terrorist groups to attempt DIY genocides, and even if they fail at their goal that may still cause megadeaths… but we may well also have defences against it, either biological or surveillance. Similar issues for drones and high-powered lasers. We've already got government-affordable ways to put literally every human on the planet under 24/7 surveillance, and that's likely to get cheap enough for organised crime to automate blackmail, but we also already have people doing that with generative AI and the social responses (let alone the legislative) could be almost anything. 3D printed houses and boats are both realities now, will we finally witness large-scale seasteading, or is that fundamentally untenable? And that's all assuming no world-ending, or even just economy-ending, catastrophes of any kind — no paperclip optimisers, no nuclear wars, no peak-${insert-resource-here}, no environmental issues causing 1e9-scale migration.

maxdoop 3y ago

"I'm not giving anyone else a chance" -- there is no "anyone else". There is nothing being robbed, as there is no other party that literally exists in the universe.