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Events like this emperor's pardon, in the end, may have led to the fall of the russian czarist regime. If I'm not mistaken, Lenin himself, and even Stalin, were

Events like this emperor's pardon, in the end, may have led to the fall of the russian czarist regime. If I'm not mistaken, Lenin himself, and even Stalin, were exiled instead of being executed. It looks like it becane a tradition for russian czars to go lenient on the most dangerous people society had produced when it came to their own safety.

ein0p 3y ago
No doubt. Though there's also the fact that more violence could have led to a harsh blowback much sooner, as it has in the past sometimes. I'm thankful Dostoevsky in particular was spared execution. He, in my humble opinion, is the greatest novelist to have ever lived, especially if you can read his works in their original language, with no translation loss. I did not always think that - when I was younger I did not have the benefit of life experience to understand the depth of his works, but now, in the second half of my 40s, I can't get enough, and they _really_ speak to me, and make me really reconsider some things at a really deep level. In retrospect it kind of makes sense - Dostoevsky wrote "The Demons" when he was only a few years older than I am now, so I can relate better to it. Following the same logic, I'll have to re-read "Brothers Karamazov" about 10 years from now, and I'm sure I'll get even more out of it then.
lostlogin 3y ago
> it becane a tradition for russian czars to go lenient on the most dangerous people society had produced when it came to their own safety. Was it this, or was it that they were imprisoning so may people that killing them all was impractical? Separating the bad from the very bad became rather tricky as the state disintegrated. > If I'm not mistaken, Lenin himself, and even Stalin, were exiled Simon Sebag-Montefiore has done a great book about Stalin’s early years [1]. The follow [2] on is good too, but even darker. [1] https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/826564.Young_Stalin https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/826564.Young_Stalin [2] https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/282108.Stalin https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/282108.Stalin
- kikokikokiko 3y ago
  When it came to Stalin, he was already a full blown terrorist, the type of scum that bragged about throwing grenades on groups of people at a local street fair. Exiling a guy like this, instead of finishing the job, is an inexcusable mistake on the government's part.
  - lostlogin 3y ago
    Extreme times promote extreme behaviour. He was a terrible human, and the regime he was fighting was too.
    - ein0p 3y ago
      The regime he was fighting was far too humane for its own good, that is quite obvious in retrospect. Stalin, however, is not a black and white figure for Russian/Soviet history. On the one hand yes, there were purges, and a large famine on his watch. Millions perished. But on the other he industrialized the country and won WW2, which most likely would be impossible without industrialization. I wish there were easier answers to these moral questions, but there never are if one thinks in more than one dimension
      - lostlogin 3y ago
        > The regime he was fighting was far too humane for its own good Compared to communist Russia, maybe, but it was cruel, unequal and badly run by every measure I can think of. I don’t think you can describe it as ‘humane’ by any real measure except comparison with what followed.

ein0p 3y ago

No doubt. Though there's also the fact that more violence could have led to a harsh blowback much sooner, as it has in the past sometimes. I'm thankful Dostoevsky in particular was spared execution. He, in my humble opinion, is the greatest novelist to have ever lived, especially if you can read his works in their original language, with no translation loss. I did not always think that - when I was younger I did not have the benefit of life experience to understand the depth of his works, but now, in the second half of my 40s, I can't get enough, and they _really_ speak to me, and make me really reconsider some things at a really deep level. In retrospect it kind of makes sense - Dostoevsky wrote "The Demons" when he was only a few years older than I am now, so I can relate better to it. Following the same logic, I'll have to re-read "Brothers Karamazov" about 10 years from now, and I'm sure I'll get even more out of it then.

lostlogin 3y ago

> it becane a tradition for russian czars to go lenient on the most dangerous people society had produced when it came to their own safety. Was it this, or was it that they were imprisoning so may people that killing them all was impractical? Separating the bad from the very bad became rather tricky as the state disintegrated. > If I'm not mistaken, Lenin himself, and even Stalin, were exiled Simon Sebag-Montefiore has done a great book about Stalin’s early years [1]. The follow [2] on is good too, but even darker. [1] https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/826564.Young_Stalin https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/826564.Young_Stalin [2] https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/282108.Stalin https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/282108.Stalin

kikokikokiko 3y ago
When it came to Stalin, he was already a full blown terrorist, the type of scum that bragged about throwing grenades on groups of people at a local street fair. Exiling a guy like this, instead of finishing the job, is an inexcusable mistake on the government's part.
- lostlogin 3y ago
  Extreme times promote extreme behaviour. He was a terrible human, and the regime he was fighting was too.
  - ein0p 3y ago
    The regime he was fighting was far too humane for its own good, that is quite obvious in retrospect. Stalin, however, is not a black and white figure for Russian/Soviet history. On the one hand yes, there were purges, and a large famine on his watch. Millions perished. But on the other he industrialized the country and won WW2, which most likely would be impossible without industrialization. I wish there were easier answers to these moral questions, but there never are if one thinks in more than one dimension
    - lostlogin 3y ago
      > The regime he was fighting was far too humane for its own good Compared to communist Russia, maybe, but it was cruel, unequal and badly run by every measure I can think of. I don’t think you can describe it as ‘humane’ by any real measure except comparison with what followed.