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The Far Right's Favorite Web Host Has a Shadowy New Owner

25 points by bhartzer 3y ago

throwup238 3y ago
https://archive.ph/TMe6z https://archive.ph/TMe6z
jevoten 3y ago
> Epik.com has been for years the go-to domain registrar for websites that other companies refuse to do business with. Sites dedicated to white nationalism, QAnon conspiracy theories, and harassing transgender people were all welcomed by Epik. As a foreigner, this confuses me. We are told the US is systemically racist and white supremacist, rife with white hetero-patriarchy etc.. but Wired claims white nationalist websites have trouble even finding a registrar to take their business? Something doesn't add up.
- treflop 3y ago
  Because it's neither. It's like wherever you are from -- there are some diehard racists, a lot of people who are vehemently not racist, but everyone else is just going with the flow.
- daveguy 3y ago
  The white nationalists are, by definition, ignorant AF. Also, it seems you don't know the difference between systemic racism (baked into institutions) and individual racism or lack thereof -- the individuals making decisions opt against the ignorant AF white nationalists when their racism is pointed out. Apparently there are only enough white nationalists who are not ignorant AF to make up a single registrar.
  - jevoten 3y ago
    > you don't know the difference between systemic racism (baked into institutions) and individual racism This does confuse me, yes. How can institutions or the system be systemically racist, yet strive to suppress white nationalism? Isn't that the definition of anti-racism?
    - jfengel 3y ago
      "Systemic racism" is about the quiet, daily, "small" racisms that most people don't notice or pay any attention to. As an example, consider the ban on affirmative action programs, while leaving in place things like legacy admissions. The latter isn't isn't explicitly racist, and yet it tends to benefit the people who come from families admitted at a time when they were explicitly racist. That's just one of countless possibilities. Each one is, potentially, easily dismissed as unimportant. But there are a lot of things that, collectively, add up to serious problems for people who have been historically disadvantaged on the account of their race. It's sometimes called "racism without racists", because it disadvantages some people even without conscious dislike of them. We started talking about anti-racism a decade ago or so, when the swastika-wearing white nationalists were excluded from practically all polite society, but that systemic racism was still causing a lot of problems. It was different from merely being not-racist, but seeking out the hidden causes of disproportionate effects. Since then, just plain white nationalism has had a stronger resurgence. And a lot of people who consider themselves not-racist have a tendency to say, "Well, they've got their right to be racist as long as they're not being violent", ignoring the ways that threats are hard to prosecute but still have consequences. They get to consider themselves non-racist because at least they're not actively wearing white robes and using racist slurs. A lot of people still don't want to do business with explicit racists, and they scream bloody murder about it, even though it's exactly the same kind of free-association that the racists are relying on that somebody will support them. The effect is that we're dealing with both explicit racism and systemic racism at the same time. They're different and sometimes opposed, even though they also bolster each other.
      - jevoten 3y ago
        > As an example, consider the ban on affirmative action programs, while leaving in place things like legacy admissions. The latter isn't isn't explicitly racist, and yet it tends to benefit the people who come from families admitted at a time when they were explicitly racist. Now I'm even more confused. Legacy admissions would seemingly benefit whites the most (I guess it depends how many generations back you look), who are also the most under-represented group in the Ivy league [1]. Did you mis-speak, and meant to use legacy admissions as another example of anti-racism? [1] https://archive.org/details/ivy-league-demographics https://archive.org/details/ivy-league-demographics
  - geodel 3y ago
    By definition? Is there a standards institute that publishes these authorized definitions?
    - daveguy 3y ago
      Here you go, buddy. https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/white%20nationalist https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/white%20nationali... Ignorant fuckwits, by definition.
- therein 3y ago
  It is just something they enjoy saying these days. It fits the narrative.
- sixothree 3y ago
  Systematic racism manifests in more of a statistical manner. You might not recognize it because the parties involved can interact without much friction. But policies will adversely affect one group of people more than others. But the racism being described here is outright and overt.
- anon25783 3y ago
  The systemic racism in the public and private economic sectors of American society is of a subtler character than the individual racism promoted by the kinds of people who run explicitly pro-fascist websites. Unlike those people, most US companies and government agencies are deeply concerned with appearing to not be racist, because racism is very unpopular with most American consumers and voters.
  - alphabettsy 3y ago
    True, but the person you’re replying to isn’t asking in good faith. Take a look at their submission history for one.
    - anon25783 3y ago
      I'm never surprised when this happens. But I wish it didn't happen so frequently on this website in particular. Oh well.
- 303uru 3y ago
  >systemically racist Yes, it is. You seem to be conflating "literal NAZIs wearing swastikas can't register a website" with "black names are less likely to get an interview with the exact same resume".
james_david 3y ago
http://archive.today/TMe6z http://archive.today/TMe6z Epik, the host in question, is run by Rob Monster, which is either a chosen name or evidence we are living in a poorly written simulation. Truthfully, I'm not sure there's a difference.
- carlosjobim 3y ago
  It's a Dutch name. There is a whole world outside of your culture and your language.
  - liamdgray 3y ago
    What does Monster mean in Dutch? It means the same, right? Once, I worked with a guy whose surname was Den Beste. When I asked him about it, he told me that the Dutch didn't have surnames until the occupying French did a census that required each person to have a surname. He said that, to mock the occupiers, many of the Dutch chose their new surnames sarcastically, as did his ancestors, whose name means "the best." He told me "but that is nothing. Another Dutch name means something like 'little pieces of poop.'" This article lists a few more such: https://netherlandsbynumbers.com/2013/06/05/14-dutch-surnames-which-you-are-glad-are-not-yours/ https://netherlandsbynumbers.com/2013/06/05/14-dutch-surname... Not to discount your point. There's a whole world, indeed!
    - pasdutchie 3y ago
      The Dutch word "monster" means "specimen" in English. This is actually of Latin origin, and plenty of English words come from the same latin root (monstrum) like "demonstrate". Likely as not, though, the surname "Monster" just reflects a family origin in the Dutch town of Monster, near the coast southwest of The Hague.
      - liamdgray 3y ago
        Thanks for correcting me. Apparently, I was too quick to accept the first translation proposed by https://translate.google.com/?sl=en&tl=nl&text=monster&op=translate https://translate.google.com/?sl=en&tl=nl&text=monster&op=tr... And thanks to your Latin lesson, now I know that monster in English means specimen too! (I prefer to understand words in terms of their roots.)
brink 3y ago
[flagged]
- geodel 3y ago
  But then someone will complain these guys keep talking about themselves :-)
- nickthegreek 3y ago
  The article is about Epik. They provide services for Gab, BitChute, Daily Stormer, Kiwi Farms, Proud Boys, Oathkeeprs and InfoWars. You say nobody talks about the bad lefty places. Here is your opportunity! Please list the far-left sites that are receiving safe harbour.
  - hotdogscout 3y ago
    Facebook, Twitter, Instagram. Leftist radicals calling for violent retribution say that stuff largely unopposed by censoring. Weirdly enough I don't think Elon changed anything just opened the game for bigots.
    - deleted 3y ago
      [deleted]
    - nickthegreek 3y ago
      Everyone one of those sites have Far-right voices doing the same. Your list of sites are in no way equivalent to the list I provided.
      - hotdogscout 3y ago
        It's not the same. Apart from twitter it's much easier to get far right content banned than far left. The far right builds independent Websites because of censorship, otherwise normal social media would suffice. When LGBT used to be a bad word on the corporate world sites like Susan's Place did the same. Far left places like leftypol are pretty abandoned.
elcritch 3y ago
[flagged]
- fabian2k 3y ago
  The article described the content as "white nationalism, QAnon conspiracy theories, and harassing transgender people". I think it is appropriate to label that kind of content "far right".
  - elcritch 3y ago
    That kind of content would be far-right. However Wired and others seem to include sites that questions anything about the current transgender movement as harassing transgender people. The article does give details that the site is full of scam companies and other such, so it possibly does host QAnon sites and other unsavory sites. I’ve just lost trust in objectiveness of Wired or even sites like Scientific American that’d I would’ve not considered being political and somewhat technical in previous years. I reckon it’s more fallout of the polarization of American politics. I’ve seen the same with folks on the “right” as well.
    - ugiji 3y ago
      [flagged]
- nickthegreek 3y ago
  Example please?
hotdogscout 3y ago
The last 5 years made me as distrustful of the left as the 2010-2015 alt-right years made me distrustful of the right. And like with the alt-right the media and culture moves at a glacial pace, taking years before even acknowledging the issue. I used to be exclusively scared of my friends falling for far right ideas from imageboards and I'm now feeling that same fear with my friends repeating the most illiberal irrational stuff straight from twitter.
- mock-possum 3y ago
  What’s a good example of that illiberal irrational stuff?
  - hotdogscout 3y ago
    Whites deserve violent retribution for slavery discourse. Cultural appropriation. Denial of bad things done under socialist governments or those useful for the left. Race traitor discourse (if you're a racial minority but don't subscribe to radicalism). Discourse of whites being genetically inferior. Apology and support for racially motivated terrorism against white people. Virulent antisemitism.
    - 303uru 3y ago
      Where are you getting any of this? This is the alt-rights idea of the left, I see essentially none of this in my hard left circles and when some idiot shows up spewing any of it they're ostracized quickly. Meanwhile, I keep close tabs on the mutterings of the right and this is word for word the things we're supposedly saying.
      - archagon 3y ago
        Yep, OP should point to a single prominent Democrat who says things like this. In the meantime, the right is electing a repugnant criminal who wants to pardon himself, become dictator, and enact retribution on his enemies.
ChrisArchitect 3y ago
Wonder where that leaves the million(s) of dollars they stole in domain selling

25 points by bhartzer 3y ago

https://archive.ph/TMe6z https://archive.ph/TMe6z

> Epik.com has been for years the go-to domain registrar for websites that other companies refuse to do business with. Sites dedicated to white nationalism, QAnon conspiracy theories, and harassing transgender people were all welcomed by Epik. As a foreigner, this confuses me. We are told the US is systemically racist and white supremacist, rife with white hetero-patriarchy etc.. but Wired claims white nationalist websites have trouble even finding a registrar to take their business? Something doesn't add up.

treflop 3y ago
Because it's neither. It's like wherever you are from -- there are some diehard racists, a lot of people who are vehemently not racist, but everyone else is just going with the flow.
daveguy 3y ago
The white nationalists are, by definition, ignorant AF. Also, it seems you don't know the difference between systemic racism (baked into institutions) and individual racism or lack thereof -- the individuals making decisions opt against the ignorant AF white nationalists when their racism is pointed out. Apparently there are only enough white nationalists who are not ignorant AF to make up a single registrar.
- jevoten 3y ago
  > you don't know the difference between systemic racism (baked into institutions) and individual racism This does confuse me, yes. How can institutions or the system be systemically racist, yet strive to suppress white nationalism? Isn't that the definition of anti-racism?
  - jfengel 3y ago
    "Systemic racism" is about the quiet, daily, "small" racisms that most people don't notice or pay any attention to. As an example, consider the ban on affirmative action programs, while leaving in place things like legacy admissions. The latter isn't isn't explicitly racist, and yet it tends to benefit the people who come from families admitted at a time when they were explicitly racist. That's just one of countless possibilities. Each one is, potentially, easily dismissed as unimportant. But there are a lot of things that, collectively, add up to serious problems for people who have been historically disadvantaged on the account of their race. It's sometimes called "racism without racists", because it disadvantages some people even without conscious dislike of them. We started talking about anti-racism a decade ago or so, when the swastika-wearing white nationalists were excluded from practically all polite society, but that systemic racism was still causing a lot of problems. It was different from merely being not-racist, but seeking out the hidden causes of disproportionate effects. Since then, just plain white nationalism has had a stronger resurgence. And a lot of people who consider themselves not-racist have a tendency to say, "Well, they've got their right to be racist as long as they're not being violent", ignoring the ways that threats are hard to prosecute but still have consequences. They get to consider themselves non-racist because at least they're not actively wearing white robes and using racist slurs. A lot of people still don't want to do business with explicit racists, and they scream bloody murder about it, even though it's exactly the same kind of free-association that the racists are relying on that somebody will support them. The effect is that we're dealing with both explicit racism and systemic racism at the same time. They're different and sometimes opposed, even though they also bolster each other.
    - jevoten 3y ago
      > As an example, consider the ban on affirmative action programs, while leaving in place things like legacy admissions. The latter isn't isn't explicitly racist, and yet it tends to benefit the people who come from families admitted at a time when they were explicitly racist. Now I'm even more confused. Legacy admissions would seemingly benefit whites the most (I guess it depends how many generations back you look), who are also the most under-represented group in the Ivy league [1]. Did you mis-speak, and meant to use legacy admissions as another example of anti-racism? [1] https://archive.org/details/ivy-league-demographics https://archive.org/details/ivy-league-demographics
- geodel 3y ago
  By definition? Is there a standards institute that publishes these authorized definitions?
  - daveguy 3y ago
    Here you go, buddy. https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/white%20nationalist https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/white%20nationali... Ignorant fuckwits, by definition.
therein 3y ago
It is just something they enjoy saying these days. It fits the narrative.
sixothree 3y ago
Systematic racism manifests in more of a statistical manner. You might not recognize it because the parties involved can interact without much friction. But policies will adversely affect one group of people more than others. But the racism being described here is outright and overt.
anon25783 3y ago
The systemic racism in the public and private economic sectors of American society is of a subtler character than the individual racism promoted by the kinds of people who run explicitly pro-fascist websites. Unlike those people, most US companies and government agencies are deeply concerned with appearing to not be racist, because racism is very unpopular with most American consumers and voters.
- alphabettsy 3y ago
  True, but the person you’re replying to isn’t asking in good faith. Take a look at their submission history for one.
  - anon25783 3y ago
    I'm never surprised when this happens. But I wish it didn't happen so frequently on this website in particular. Oh well.
303uru 3y ago
>systemically racist Yes, it is. You seem to be conflating "literal NAZIs wearing swastikas can't register a website" with "black names are less likely to get an interview with the exact same resume".

james_david 3y ago

http://archive.today/TMe6z http://archive.today/TMe6z Epik, the host in question, is run by Rob Monster, which is either a chosen name or evidence we are living in a poorly written simulation. Truthfully, I'm not sure there's a difference.

carlosjobim 3y ago
It's a Dutch name. There is a whole world outside of your culture and your language.
- liamdgray 3y ago
  What does Monster mean in Dutch? It means the same, right? Once, I worked with a guy whose surname was Den Beste. When I asked him about it, he told me that the Dutch didn't have surnames until the occupying French did a census that required each person to have a surname. He said that, to mock the occupiers, many of the Dutch chose their new surnames sarcastically, as did his ancestors, whose name means "the best." He told me "but that is nothing. Another Dutch name means something like 'little pieces of poop.'" This article lists a few more such: https://netherlandsbynumbers.com/2013/06/05/14-dutch-surnames-which-you-are-glad-are-not-yours/ https://netherlandsbynumbers.com/2013/06/05/14-dutch-surname... Not to discount your point. There's a whole world, indeed!
  - pasdutchie 3y ago
    The Dutch word "monster" means "specimen" in English. This is actually of Latin origin, and plenty of English words come from the same latin root (monstrum) like "demonstrate". Likely as not, though, the surname "Monster" just reflects a family origin in the Dutch town of Monster, near the coast southwest of The Hague.
    - liamdgray 3y ago
      Thanks for correcting me. Apparently, I was too quick to accept the first translation proposed by https://translate.google.com/?sl=en&tl=nl&text=monster&op=translate https://translate.google.com/?sl=en&tl=nl&text=monster&op=tr... And thanks to your Latin lesson, now I know that monster in English means specimen too! (I prefer to understand words in terms of their roots.)

brink 3y ago

[flagged]

geodel 3y ago
But then someone will complain these guys keep talking about themselves :-)
nickthegreek 3y ago
The article is about Epik. They provide services for Gab, BitChute, Daily Stormer, Kiwi Farms, Proud Boys, Oathkeeprs and InfoWars. You say nobody talks about the bad lefty places. Here is your opportunity! Please list the far-left sites that are receiving safe harbour.
- hotdogscout 3y ago
  Facebook, Twitter, Instagram. Leftist radicals calling for violent retribution say that stuff largely unopposed by censoring. Weirdly enough I don't think Elon changed anything just opened the game for bigots.
  - deleted 3y ago
    [deleted]
  - nickthegreek 3y ago
    Everyone one of those sites have Far-right voices doing the same. Your list of sites are in no way equivalent to the list I provided.
    - hotdogscout 3y ago
      It's not the same. Apart from twitter it's much easier to get far right content banned than far left. The far right builds independent Websites because of censorship, otherwise normal social media would suffice. When LGBT used to be a bad word on the corporate world sites like Susan's Place did the same. Far left places like leftypol are pretty abandoned.

elcritch 3y ago

[flagged]

fabian2k 3y ago
The article described the content as "white nationalism, QAnon conspiracy theories, and harassing transgender people". I think it is appropriate to label that kind of content "far right".
- elcritch 3y ago
  That kind of content would be far-right. However Wired and others seem to include sites that questions anything about the current transgender movement as harassing transgender people. The article does give details that the site is full of scam companies and other such, so it possibly does host QAnon sites and other unsavory sites. I’ve just lost trust in objectiveness of Wired or even sites like Scientific American that’d I would’ve not considered being political and somewhat technical in previous years. I reckon it’s more fallout of the polarization of American politics. I’ve seen the same with folks on the “right” as well.
  - ugiji 3y ago
    [flagged]
nickthegreek 3y ago
Example please?

hotdogscout 3y ago

The last 5 years made me as distrustful of the left as the 2010-2015 alt-right years made me distrustful of the right. And like with the alt-right the media and culture moves at a glacial pace, taking years before even acknowledging the issue. I used to be exclusively scared of my friends falling for far right ideas from imageboards and I'm now feeling that same fear with my friends repeating the most illiberal irrational stuff straight from twitter.

mock-possum 3y ago
What’s a good example of that illiberal irrational stuff?
- hotdogscout 3y ago
  Whites deserve violent retribution for slavery discourse. Cultural appropriation. Denial of bad things done under socialist governments or those useful for the left. Race traitor discourse (if you're a racial minority but don't subscribe to radicalism). Discourse of whites being genetically inferior. Apology and support for racially motivated terrorism against white people. Virulent antisemitism.
  - 303uru 3y ago
    Where are you getting any of this? This is the alt-rights idea of the left, I see essentially none of this in my hard left circles and when some idiot shows up spewing any of it they're ostracized quickly. Meanwhile, I keep close tabs on the mutterings of the right and this is word for word the things we're supposedly saying.
    - archagon 3y ago
      Yep, OP should point to a single prominent Democrat who says things like this. In the meantime, the right is electing a repugnant criminal who wants to pardon himself, become dictator, and enact retribution on his enemies.

ChrisArchitect 3y ago

Wonder where that leaves the million(s) of dollars they stole in domain selling