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Apple drops PWA support on iOS for EU users
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]
- malermeister 3y agoI see Apple is trying the "self harm as a threat" tactic. We'll see how that goes for them.
- cranberryturkey 3y agoapple is quietly laying off engineers now anyway.
- aitchnyu 3y agoSource?
- cranberryturkey 3y agofriend of mine works there
- mtomweb 3y agoin Safari/webkit or more broadly?
- cranberryturkey 3y agothis is on internal apps team
- JumpCrisscross 3y agoI suppose this will yield a real-world test of the EC's enforcement powers. To my understanding, they have little unilateral power--their legislative powers are limited to initiative (not a paltry power, but not a unilateral one either) and its enforcement power seems to consist of taking cases to the ECJ. Does the ECJ grant the EC injunctions?
- jsnell 3y agoAs far as I know, the EC is the prosecution, jury and judge. They investigate the case, decide on the guilt, and decide the penalty. The court systems do exist as an appeals mechanism, but my impression is that they pretty much never overrule the EC on competition issues.
- malermeister 3y agoYup, the EC can do pretty much what it sees fit when it comes to competition issues. It's not a good idea to challenge them, as Facebook and Google have already learned. Guess it's Apple's turn next.
- spense 3y agoIt's not true. According to a follow-up tweet: > Sites that had some PWA information provided - such as an iOS icon - would be added as PWAs even though they weren’t. They have tightened up things so that only sites that are explicitly configured as PWAs will be added as such. https://x.com/JamesRLandrum/status/1755411290107863429?s=20 https://x.com/JamesRLandrum/status/1755411290107863429?s=20
- mtomweb 3y agoWe’ve had more than 10 people test it, and it completely breaks all PWAs. Why are you trusting some randoms tweet as a credible source?
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]
- borisjabes 3y agoThis might be a misunderstanding. The following tweet implies they’ve just tightened the standard for how sites are supposed to be configured as PWAs. https://x.com/jamesrlandrum/status/1755411290107863429 https://x.com/jamesrlandrum/status/1755411290107863429
- viraptor 3y agoBoth can be true. If what you did before doesn't work now and potentially drops your storage, the explanation doesn't matter. It could be a planned improvement in theory. It still broke things for people - literally dropped support for some PWA that mattered to people.
- mtomweb 3y agoThis person is incorrect and doesn’t know what he’s talking about. You need to look at the full video of it action to realize the difference in behavior from 17.3 and 17.4 beta 1 and beta 2
- lozenge 3y agoI have never seen a normal person use or install a PWA so this seems like pointlessly picking a fight on Apple's part.
- WA 3y agoSuch a backwards viewpoint. Just because normal people don't know about it yet, doesn't mean it can't work in the future. Needs a bit of re-training and possibly a couple bigger apps going full PWA.
- jckahn 3y agoI’m as big of a PWA advocate as any, and even I don’t think this will ever happen. PWAs are the most user-centric app platform, but it’s not conceptually intuitive to the average user. For that to change, PWAs need a strong marketing push. I don’t see anyone stepping up to do that.
- mo_42 3y agoI'm a long-term Linux user and started buying Apple products long ago. I still keep my iPhone 4S around because I think it's a piece of art. I think the hardware and physical design of Apple products is really great. When I heard about this new EU regulation, I started to consider retiring my iPhone. I developed my own iOS app, but I'm unable to run it permanently because I need to get it approved by Apple to install it on my own device. PWAs are an alternative I was considering, and I'm also using some from others. If this is true. I'll switch to Android. The only device I'd keep using actively is the M1 MacBook because it's running Asahi Linux and I haven't booted into MacOS for months now.
- malermeister 3y agoHow's Asahi on the M1 macbook? I'm considering switching, too.
- mo_42 3y agoFeels like it's constantly improving. I'm running it since 1.5 years. Battery life is much better now. It even supports TLP (with the AUR version). Hard to tell what I'm missing currently. But I'm using rather basic tools in the command line and all these work fine. Of course Firefox works. Inkscape, Darktable, TexLive, too.
- malermeister 3y agoLooking at the site, it looks like it still doesn't support USB-C displays or Thunderbolt, which unfortunately, for me, is a dealbreaker (I use my MBA with a Thunderbolt dock on my desk). Looks like I'll still have to wait for a while. How's battery life compared to macOS?
- siquick 3y ago> I developed my own iOS app, but I'm unable to run it permanently because I need to get it approved by Apple to install it on my own device. This isn’t the case anymore. If using Expo you can also do it through EAS Build. https://developer.apple.com/help/account/manage-profiles/create-an-ad-hoc-provisioning-profile/ https://developer.apple.com/help/account/manage-profiles/cre... https://docs.expo.dev/build/internal-distribution/#22-configure-app-signing-credentials-for-ios https://docs.expo.dev/build/internal-distribution/#22-config...
- fxtentacle 3y agoMy guess would be that Apple is trying to blackmail some large software company inside the EU. And after careful consideration, they noticed that threatening to wipe all of their apps data of all Apple devices will do. If my theory is correct, we will soon see a large EU software company - which deployed PWAs in the past - mysteriously start supporting Apple in their refusal to open up to alternative App Stores in the EU. They will talk about security and user choice, while completely ignoring that the EU is merely asking Apple to treat them as well as China. In China, Apple has already been allowing 3rd party app stores for some years. For what it's worth, I used to be a proud Apple user. But recently, I can't help but imagine the financial incentives behind their every move.
- ranguna 3y agoA lot of companies in the EU only survive due to government grants, so I'm not sure apple will be successful on this one. They are trying a USA strategy on EU soil.
- akmarinov 3y agoWhich one would that be? Nothing comes to mind.
- bjw4 3y agoCould it be game streaming? Xbox Xcloud uses a PWA.
- akmarinov 3y agoBut they wanted to use a native app, submitted it to the AppStore, Apple said no and Xbox had to go the PWA way. And now Apple reversed that decision for all regions, so Xbox are free to submit it again. Doesn't make sense to be "forcing" them.
- youngtaff 3y agoCan we correct the headline… This is just Max’s viewpoint and others in the thread who are actually in Europe have confirmed it works for them
- judiisis 3y agoNo it doesn't work for anyone in the EU for any type of pwa
- slau 3y agoI just saved https://whatpwacando.today/ https://whatpwacando.today/ to my Home Screen and opened it as a PWA from there, was able to launch the camera etc. I’m in the EU on the latest version of iOS.
- mtomweb 3y agoAre you on 17.4 beta 2? If so I’ll have more questions. People have been saying it's working for them in the EU: the Apple's detection is complex and seem to take into account different parameters, like the ios region, but also the origin country of the sim card used. But note this behavior only occurs if you are in the EU and you are using 17.4 beta 1 or beta 2
- slau 3y agoMy bad, I didn’t know beta versions were in play here. I’m on the latest stable version of iOS, 17.3.
- youngtaff 3y agoAnd yet there are other people in the very same thread for who it works e.g. https://twitter.com/fr3ino/status/1755511944016973873 https://twitter.com/fr3ino/status/1755511944016973873 So your statement isn’t accurate
- naton 3y ago
- foverzar 3y agoWait, has Web Push ever worked on iOS?
- Sominemo 3y agoThey added support for it in iOS 16.4, but websites can access it only when they are added to home screen. Thus, no home screen access means no Web Push.
- mtomweb 3y agoIt was only as a result of regulatory pressure
- Khaine 3y agoAs a user, web push is a terrible idea. It's not something I want. I'm glad its so hard to do on iOS.
- jauntywundrkind 3y agoSuch aggressively zero sum thinking. Maybe you have a fine native calendar app available to you on your platform that you trust. Great, good for you. Maybe you have a messenger app on your native platform that you trust. Good for you, we are happy for you! To use that to say the web shouldn't have a capability is incredibly cruel. Other users have corporate controlled systems and school laptops and terminals at public library. These users have next to no power, but the web is a common baseline for humanity that does serve & help everyone. It should have this capability, be possible to do this thing. If this feature annoys you, don't use it. Turn it off. This is the web: get an extension that blocks Web Push requests preemptively. You as a web user have a user agent at your back that is flexible & configurable in how you browse the web. Just telling people they can't have a feature because In Your High Opinion It's Bad takes so much. Other people should have the liberty too. The web should have features, not cater to those who insist on its withdrawal from spaces they carve out.
- burnerthrow008 3y ago
- Alifatisk 3y agoThere is no way to install PWA on FF for iOS anyways.
- slau 3y agoThat’s not true. Burger menu -> Share -> Add to Home Screen Works fine.
- bunbun69 3y agoall 5 people who use PWAs will be very mad!
- sccxy 3y agoI work in company with 100+ PWA users where we had to buy cheap android phones because iOS PWA support is non-existing and every update makes PWAs worse. Native app is not possible, app stores rules do now allow to publish our app. We had "the most powerful and advanced smartphones" (TM) iPhones first, but Safari is always running out of memory. But now with 150 eur Android phones, there are no more memory issues...
- singularity2001 3y agoPWA Progressive web app ?
- r-spaghetti 3y agoRelevant info: https://pluralistic.net/2024/02/06/spoil-the-bunch/#dma https://pluralistic.net/2024/02/06/spoil-the-bunch/#dma
- kjreact 3y agoI had to look this up: PWA stands for Progressive Web App and according to web.dev is “a webapp that uses progressive enhancement.” On iOS you can install a PWA using the “Add to Home Screen” function.
- mob_eng 3y agoMy guess is: DMA asks Apple to allow other browser vendors have the same access as Safari has. Probably APIs for adding sites to the Home Screen slipped in the development time and is coming later
- arendtio 3y agoHow many years did it take until Apple accepted USB-C? Let us count the years until they understand the mess they are creating right now...