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Let’s apply this same thing to humans. If a human engaged in this situation, no one would blink an eye. SF had a “zero motor deaths” goal for 2024 and there we

Let’s apply this same thing to humans. If a human engaged in this situation, no one would blink an eye. SF had a “zero motor deaths” goal for 2024 and there were human drivers in protest that any changes made to save lives would be inconvenient (eg removing parking spots to increase visibility). The ease at which people will negotiate a human life for parking is horrifying. And likely speaks to how they drive. We really should make driving much more cautious and undesirable. Any incident should result in serious penalties. In MA, if you’re <18, and you get a ticket, you automatically have your license suspended, and depending on severity, you may need to re-apply for a license, and start the testing and permitting process over. This really should be the adult process too. If people are worried that loss of driving will disrupt their life, then all of society might slowly become less car dependent. This would have great effects on the environment, people would have shorter commutes, they’d probably be healthier. Cities would be more walkable, people would save money on the incredibly expense that is cars, and so much more.

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ambigious7777 3y ago
This. I've seen all of those walkable cities, green cities, etc... For the most part, I think that staying away from driving is a good idea. If we could have cities planned out so that anything would just be a few minutes walk away, that would solve so many problems. A car-independent society would have many improvements. Even for medium distance travel, we could have trains and such.
- shiroiuma 3y ago
  What you're describing is exactly how a large part of Japanese society lives today. It's one of the main reasons I moved here. I don't need a car, I walk or cycle or take trains wherever I need to go, including to other cities. Americans really don't want to live in this kind of society. They don't like walking that much, and they like the isolation and feeling of superiority they get by driving around in an expensive vehicle that signals their class, and they generally hate walking anyway.
  - vineyardmike 3y ago
    > Americans really don't want to live in this kind of society. What's crazy is I don't think this is true. I think Americans think they want a car-centric society, and we've structured so much of society to reduce our freedom to chose the alternative. Where do Americans like to vacation? Walkable places. What cities and suburbs are regularly the most expensive and desirable in their area? Walkable ones. We built malls and commercial developments that provide walkability within a suburb. Literal Disney's fantasy main-street is just modeled on the walkable core of a suburb. Americans will say that cars give them freedom to go anywhere, then complain all the good places don't have enough parking. Americans will tell you that college is the best time of their life, and it's largely because everyone was within walking distance to their social life, their job (classes), and their home. They eschew the commitment of vehicles, and they live close to others, and with less stuff. Anyways, I guess I'm jealous you get to live in Japan, because I totally wish that America could invest in our transit like Japan has.
    - shiroiuma 3y ago
      >Where do Americans like to vacation? Walkable places. No, only some Americans vacation there. It's not like 80% of Americans all travel to European cities every year. In my observation, many Americans prefer to go to various US cities and rent cars, or to go to beach resorts, or spend their time on cruise ships drinking all day long. >Americans will say that cars give them freedom to go anywhere, then complain all the good places don't have enough parking. Right, this is one of the fundamental problems. Americans just don't understand that you can't have both. >Anyways, I guess I'm jealous you get to live in Japan, because I totally wish that America could invest in our transit like Japan has. Japan invested in transit because everything was already very dense. You can't just slap transit into a city like Houston and expect it to work out: you need high density to make it work. Living in Tokyo generally involves a LOT of walking (and stairs!); it's not like every destination is a block from a train station. It's why so many people own bicycles. Trains (and esp. subways) are extremely expensive to install and run and maintain, so you need very high ridership to make them work economically, and American cities outside of Manhattan just don't have that. You would need to change many things to get to Tokyo-level density; it'd be easier to just bulldoze the entire city and start over. If you want to live in Japan and have tech skills, there's plenty of companies hiring here.

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ambigious7777 3y ago

This. I've seen all of those walkable cities, green cities, etc... For the most part, I think that staying away from driving is a good idea. If we could have cities planned out so that anything would just be a few minutes walk away, that would solve so many problems. A car-independent society would have many improvements. Even for medium distance travel, we could have trains and such.

shiroiuma 3y ago
What you're describing is exactly how a large part of Japanese society lives today. It's one of the main reasons I moved here. I don't need a car, I walk or cycle or take trains wherever I need to go, including to other cities. Americans really don't want to live in this kind of society. They don't like walking that much, and they like the isolation and feeling of superiority they get by driving around in an expensive vehicle that signals their class, and they generally hate walking anyway.
- vineyardmike 3y ago
  > Americans really don't want to live in this kind of society. What's crazy is I don't think this is true. I think Americans think they want a car-centric society, and we've structured so much of society to reduce our freedom to chose the alternative. Where do Americans like to vacation? Walkable places. What cities and suburbs are regularly the most expensive and desirable in their area? Walkable ones. We built malls and commercial developments that provide walkability within a suburb. Literal Disney's fantasy main-street is just modeled on the walkable core of a suburb. Americans will say that cars give them freedom to go anywhere, then complain all the good places don't have enough parking. Americans will tell you that college is the best time of their life, and it's largely because everyone was within walking distance to their social life, their job (classes), and their home. They eschew the commitment of vehicles, and they live close to others, and with less stuff. Anyways, I guess I'm jealous you get to live in Japan, because I totally wish that America could invest in our transit like Japan has.
  - shiroiuma 3y ago
    >Where do Americans like to vacation? Walkable places. No, only some Americans vacation there. It's not like 80% of Americans all travel to European cities every year. In my observation, many Americans prefer to go to various US cities and rent cars, or to go to beach resorts, or spend their time on cruise ships drinking all day long. >Americans will say that cars give them freedom to go anywhere, then complain all the good places don't have enough parking. Right, this is one of the fundamental problems. Americans just don't understand that you can't have both. >Anyways, I guess I'm jealous you get to live in Japan, because I totally wish that America could invest in our transit like Japan has. Japan invested in transit because everything was already very dense. You can't just slap transit into a city like Houston and expect it to work out: you need high density to make it work. Living in Tokyo generally involves a LOT of walking (and stairs!); it's not like every destination is a block from a train station. It's why so many people own bicycles. Trains (and esp. subways) are extremely expensive to install and run and maintain, so you need very high ridership to make them work economically, and American cities outside of Manhattan just don't have that. You would need to change many things to get to Tokyo-level density; it'd be easier to just bulldoze the entire city and start over. If you want to live in Japan and have tech skills, there's plenty of companies hiring here.