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I live in the north north east (Canada). Our house had an oil furnace, we added an air source heat pump. There are periods in the winter where the heat pump ca

I live in the north north east (Canada). Our house had an oil furnace, we added an air source heat pump. There are periods in the winter where the heat pump can't keep up, but in the months early and late winter it's all we need. The net result is that it has significantly reduced our oil consumption. Add to that fact it's an A/C unit in the summer, and it's wins all the way around.

Aloha 3y ago
Heat Pumps absolutely blow both Fuel Oil and very nearly Propane out of the water in run cost, even when electricity is high. At 30f - until you exceed 15-15.5 cents per kWh, heat pump is cheaper to run than median oil price.
- lsllc 3y ago
  Propane is no better than oil in terms of cost per BTU (except propane boilers are usually slightly more efficient). Natural Gas (from the street) is significantly cheaper than either oil or propane per BTU and particularly if used with a modern condensing boiler. It’s not that a heat pump isn’t more efficient it’s that if you have forced hot water or steam radiators you are looking at an additional $40K to retrofit forced air ducting to your house. Oh and you still need a solution for domestic hot water, probably you’ll just end up with a resistive heater (or a hybrid/heat pump unit like the Aerotherm but the heat has to come from the room).
  - Aloha 3y ago
    I went off median prices from DOE and found oil to come in at 32 cents per 10,000 BTU's propane at 24 cents per 10,000 BTU.
    - lsllc 3y ago
      You can look at the State of New Hampshire’s Dept of Energy comparisons here, updated weekly: https://www.energy.nh.gov/energy-information/nh-fuel-prices https://www.energy.nh.gov/energy-information/nh-fuel-prices Actually right now #2 heating oil is now somewhat cheaper per MBTU than propane. Also Natural Gas is slightly cheaper than heat pump per MBTU (YMMV on efficiency!) I’ve never seen propane cheaper than heating oil here! EDIT: It’s probably worth pointing out that the North East of the US is the largest heating oil market in the world.
      - Aloha 3y ago
        ooh, thats a great source - now that I've updated my calculator, your numbers match mine - I went with local prices for propane and DOE prices for propane.
- spectralblu 3y ago
  Exceed 15 c/kWh? We were past that loooooong ago in California. Here are PG&E's rates for the Bay Area... https://www.pge.com/assets/pge/docs/account/rate-plans/residential-electric-rate-plan-pricing.pdf.coredownload.pdf https://www.pge.com/assets/pge/docs/account/rate-plans/resid... The cheapest rate is 38c/kWh, the most expensive is 62c/kWh..
lsllc 3y ago
How is the heat delivered? Forced air? If so no problems with heat pumps, the modern air source can produce heat at very low outside temps and a ground source is excellent in very cold climates (if you have artesian well, or ground loop). The problem is most oil or gas fired heating systems are forced hot water (or steam) so a heat pump isn’t going to help you unless you want a mini-split in every room. Even if you have ducting for cooling with AC it likely won’t have enough CFMs for heat in the winter unless it was specifically sized that way (but you likely wouldn’t be still using forced hot water or steam in that case).

Aloha 3y ago

Heat Pumps absolutely blow both Fuel Oil and very nearly Propane out of the water in run cost, even when electricity is high. At 30f - until you exceed 15-15.5 cents per kWh, heat pump is cheaper to run than median oil price.

lsllc 3y ago
Propane is no better than oil in terms of cost per BTU (except propane boilers are usually slightly more efficient). Natural Gas (from the street) is significantly cheaper than either oil or propane per BTU and particularly if used with a modern condensing boiler. It’s not that a heat pump isn’t more efficient it’s that if you have forced hot water or steam radiators you are looking at an additional $40K to retrofit forced air ducting to your house. Oh and you still need a solution for domestic hot water, probably you’ll just end up with a resistive heater (or a hybrid/heat pump unit like the Aerotherm but the heat has to come from the room).
- Aloha 3y ago
  I went off median prices from DOE and found oil to come in at 32 cents per 10,000 BTU's propane at 24 cents per 10,000 BTU.
  - lsllc 3y ago
    You can look at the State of New Hampshire’s Dept of Energy comparisons here, updated weekly: https://www.energy.nh.gov/energy-information/nh-fuel-prices https://www.energy.nh.gov/energy-information/nh-fuel-prices Actually right now #2 heating oil is now somewhat cheaper per MBTU than propane. Also Natural Gas is slightly cheaper than heat pump per MBTU (YMMV on efficiency!) I’ve never seen propane cheaper than heating oil here! EDIT: It’s probably worth pointing out that the North East of the US is the largest heating oil market in the world.
    - Aloha 3y ago
      ooh, thats a great source - now that I've updated my calculator, your numbers match mine - I went with local prices for propane and DOE prices for propane.
spectralblu 3y ago
Exceed 15 c/kWh? We were past that loooooong ago in California. Here are PG&E's rates for the Bay Area... https://www.pge.com/assets/pge/docs/account/rate-plans/residential-electric-rate-plan-pricing.pdf.coredownload.pdf https://www.pge.com/assets/pge/docs/account/rate-plans/resid... The cheapest rate is 38c/kWh, the most expensive is 62c/kWh..

lsllc 3y ago

How is the heat delivered? Forced air? If so no problems with heat pumps, the modern air source can produce heat at very low outside temps and a ground source is excellent in very cold climates (if you have artesian well, or ground loop). The problem is most oil or gas fired heating systems are forced hot water (or steam) so a heat pump isn’t going to help you unless you want a mini-split in every room. Even if you have ducting for cooling with AC it likely won’t have enough CFMs for heat in the winter unless it was specifically sized that way (but you likely wouldn’t be still using forced hot water or steam in that case).