6 ms·
The EU sets the limit for bank transfer time to 10 seconds
- Sphax 3y ago> Charges applied by a PSP in respect to instant credit transfer transactions in euro cannot be higher than the charges applied to “non- instant” credit transfer transactions in euro. does this mean instant SEPA transfers must now be free ? Because currently my french bank charges 1€ or something for instant SEPA transfers but doesn't charge anything for non-instant SEPA transfers.
- Traubenfuchs 3y ago> does this mean instant SEPA transfers must now be free ? It seems that is the point. With my current bank it‘s free, but I need to enable it for every transaction. Annoying.
- FirmwareBurner 3y agoSame in Austria. Vanilla SEPA is free(1-3 days) but Instant SEPA is €1.50 at my discount bank. They're just trying to milk every possible avenue while they can. Poor banks. /s
- diogocp 3y agoNo. Banks can charge for non-instant transfers, and many do.
- fransje26 3y agoIt's fun when you know that SEPA transfers are: - Guaranteed by the European central bank, that is advancing the money for free - Done instantaneously, by the ECB - Cost around 0.01 euro per transfer So the entire delay between sending and receiving the money, that banks pretend is used to guarantee that the transfer is legitimate, and that the money exists etc, etc is actually purely artificial. The ECB is shouldering the risk, and advancing the money, free of cost. All the rest (extra charges, delays, etc.) are banks handsomely lining their pockets.
- JackSlateur 3y agoAs-tu déjà penser à changer de banque .. ? Les virements, comme les CB, c'est gratuit depuis des années chez des grosses banques comme boursorama
- vwkd 3y agoIIUC, it depends on your bank. If your bank doesn’t charge you for normal transfers, it can’t charge you for instant transfers. Since most banks don’t charge for normal transfers, it will be free for most users.
- hulitu 3y ago> does this mean instant SEPA transfers must now be free ? No. It just means that your transactions will fail because of poor internet. /s
- TigPT 3y agoI think this is already a reality in Brasil. I’m really glad to see Europe making laws that improve citizens quality and competitiveness for companies.
- vdaea 3y agoHow does a law like this increase competitiveness? It looks like it decreases competitiveness, since banks can no longer compete on who has the fastest transfers.
- MattPalmer1086 3y agoDid banks ever compete on this? In any case, transfers rely on both banks processing the transaction speedily, so it wouldn't seem like something one bank could do unilaterally.
- short_sells_poo 3y agoAre you serious? It sets the ceiling on transfer time so that a minimum baseline quality of service is ensured.
- vdaea 3y agoI'm not saying that it's not good for customers. I'm saying that it does not increase competitiveness, which was the claim.
- syrgian 3y agoCompanies (not banks) that can now settle payments almost in real-time rather than wait a day to confirm that the payment has been received makes them more competitive global-economy wise.
- vdaea 3y agoHow does this make banks more competitive global-economy wise when these 10-minute transfers won't work with banks outside the EU?
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]
- zettabomb 3y agoMeanwhile here in the US, we still have payments that take up to 5 days to fully "clear". As far as I can tell, the only reason for this because other payments take a long time to clear, and thus until those have been reconciled you won't know if there's actually enough money in the source account or if some fraud has taken place. Of course, this is kind of a self feeding problem, so it would seem that such a limit on transaction time would make the problem (with transaction time) disappear.
- athenot 3y agoThis is changing with FedNow, where payments settle fast enough for synchronous applications. https://www.frbservices.org/financial-services/fednow https://www.frbservices.org/financial-services/fednow
- sidewndr46 3y agoFedNow is a service for banks, not for bank customers. The original post is about timelines for customers transfers
- throw0101b 3y agoIndividuals too: > FedNow is an instant payment service developed by the Federal Reserve for depository institutions in the United States, which allows individuals and businesses to send and receive money.[1][2][3][4] * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FedNow https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FedNow > The FedNow Service went live on July 20, 2023. It is available to depository institutions in the United States and enables individuals and businesses to send instant payments through their depository institution accounts. […] At the most fundamental level, the service provides interbank clearing and settlement that enables funds to be transferred from the account of a sender to the account of a receiver in near real-time and at any time […] * https://www.federalreserve.gov/paymentsystems/fednow_about.htm https://www.federalreserve.gov/paymentsystems/fednow_about.h... > The Federal Reserve said on Monday that it would create a real-time payments system, with the goal of making paychecks and money transfers available for use more quickly. * https://www.nytimes.com/2019/08/05/business/economy/fed-real-time-payments.html https://www.nytimes.com/2019/08/05/business/economy/fed-real... (Your back-end has to be fast before your front-end can be.)
- giuliomagnifico 3y agoThis will be a significant improvement for EU citizens! I hope banks will adhere to this law without creating problems/appeals.
- odiroot 3y agoInteresting it took so long. In UK it already takes way below 10s. Would it also apply during the night and, on weekends and holidays?
- Xylakant 3y agoWithin the UK is a different beast than within 20 different nations, which the EU (or here the Eurozone) still is, despite all progress that’s been made.
- troupo 3y agoAccording to the article, yes. """ An instant credit transfer is supposed to be executed regardless of the day or hour and the money must arrive into the recipient’s account within ten seconds. """
- the_mitsuhiko 3y agoSEPA instant already exists, but banks charge money for it sometimes. For instance N26 charges 49ct for an instant transfer vs free for one that settles next day. Not sure why banks decided to nickle and dime you on this.
- Xylakant 3y agoAnd not all banks support this, as I found out to my dismay. Now I have accounts at two different banks, because having the option to make an instant transfer is always great.
- pc86 3y agoBecause they can, and when you're talking about tens or hundreds of millions of people, enough are willing to spend .49 to get the money immediately that it adds up to a nontrivial amount of money.
- pityJuke 3y agoUK from what I can tell is world leading on fast payments, having launched Faster Payments Service in 2008. (India is now there with UPI, and I hear Brazil is doing great too. The USA has started the process, although it’ll take some time.)
- V__ 3y ago> The text was adopted with 599 votes to 7 and 35 abstentions. Seeing this made me kind of happy. At least there are still some topics where most politicians can still agree on something.
- zenlf 3y agoWho is taking the loss if a PSP has a robust and up-to-date fraud detection and prevention measures, but fraud still happens?
- dv_dt 3y agoIs there a good reference for how fraud is handled in this kind of EU transfer context? Or even recommended general reading resources for EU transfer standards?
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]
- nabla9 3y agoThe "Customer safety, penalties and sanctions" in the article. Then: PSD2 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Payment_Services_Directive https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Payment_Services_Directive SCA https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strong_customer_authentication https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strong_customer_authentication
- sva_ 3y agoWhen these were first introduced in 2017, it was around the time of one of those crypto crazes. People were arguing in favor of blockchain because of fast transfer times. It felt to me as if the banks were like: "hold my beer, we can do that too." So if that contributed to it, it'd actually be something good that came out of crypto.
- Symbiote 3y agoI don't think it's anything to do with cryptocurrency. The large British banks introduced their equivalent (being outside the Euro) in 2009-2010. I expect other European countries had national systems at around that time too.
- p_l 3y agoBritish banks were arguably quite slow at the time, with cheques and 5 business day clearing still being common (as well as inane account numbering scheme). But SEPA system was something that was "in the works" for I think a decade by then. A lot of it was essentially setting up faster interconnection that was compatible and cooperated with existing SWIFT systems and essentially enforced one standard set of parameters.
- yellow_postit 3y agoAnd not a blockchain in sight for this improvement. Looking forward to the US getting something like this for consumers in 10 years (going off the credit card chip progress)
- reactDev05 3y agoIt's crazy that it isn't working like that in EU already. In Russia money transfers worked instantly even 15 years ago.
- supermatt 3y agoThey have worked in individual countries like that in EU too. This is between EU countries - cross border and cross currency.
- rsynnott 3y ago> and cross currency Not cross-currency, I don't think? SEPA is for euro only; while there are a few non-euro-using countries in SEPA, it's applicable only to euro transfers for those countries.
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]
- supermatt 3y agoI believe it also covers transferring euros from a non-euro account (where the bank implicitly processes the FX). But yes, I suppose that isn't really cross-currency.