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I mean... yeah? I don't understand why your comment is phrased like you're speaking some truth nobody wants to admit. Python traded off speed for flexibility et

by gipp 3y ago

I mean... yeah? I don't understand why your comment is phrased like you're speaking some truth nobody wants to admit. Python traded off speed for flexibility etc. This is neither news nor some kind of mortal sin

1vuio0pswjnm7 3y ago
There are HN commenters and people who blog about programming that attempt to argue against any statement that Python is slow.^1 This comment I am replying to is itself defensive. If Python is slow and everyone knows and accepts it as true then why does the statement "Python is slow" consistently trigger defensive comments. Why am I even having to bother typing this reply. Why would anyone care enough to make some "counterargument" if anyone states that Python is slow, or I state I am not using it because it is slow. Python is already an overwhelmingly popular language choice. 1. For example, https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31200989 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31200989 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35906158 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35906158 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22040899 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22040899 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16978932 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16978932 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31845729 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31845729
- gipp 3y ago
  ?? In your links, I see either a) people responding because some commenter is being weirdly aggressive about an issue that is not controversial and that nobody is on the other side of (like me, responding to you, right now), or b) people pretty calmly and lucidly discussing the relative merits of small performance improvements vs the required development time, or increased complexity, or some other tradeoff. You know, engineering.
  - 1vuio0pswjnm7 3y ago
    What you don't see is how many upvotes I got for stating that Python is slow. It would seem I am not the only one who notices the constant, absurd attempts to discount this simple fact. The title of this submission is "Bloated Google-cloud-CLI contains an entire Python installation (~300MB)" I avoid Python wherever possible.
    - gipp 3y ago
      > It would seem I am not the only one who notices the constant, absurd attempts to discount this simple fact. Or... they upvoted you because Python being slow is a simple, obvious, uncontroversial truth that nobody disagrees with? Do you understand that I'm not trying to disagree with you on that point? The point is not that you're wrong about Python being slow, it's that you're wrong that this is somehow a secret nobody wants to admit, and you're wrong that this is somehow an evil thing that Python should be shunned for. There are no "constant, absurd attempts to discount this simple fact." The discussions you linked aren't doing that, they're just talking about the relative cost and importance of improving that slowness. Python is slow because accepting slowness lets the language be simpler, more flexible, and sometimes more expressive. For some use cases, this is an excellent tradeoff. For other use cases it's a terrible one. I don't understand why you see this as some kind of moral crusade.
      - 1vuio0pswjnm7 3y ago
        "Python is slow." <--- HN commenters like "gipp" will be unable to control their urge to "defend" their favorite scripting language. They will interpet this statement to mean nonsense such as "this is somehow an evil thing that Python should be shunned for". They will treat this statement as an invitation to discuss the "tradeoffs" of Python. Let's try this one more time. "Python is slow. It's bloated. I do not use it." There is nothing about "secrets" or "evil" or "moral crusade" or some other hyperbolic nonsense. There is nothing to interpret. I do not care about Python's tradeoffs. I do not care why it is slow. More replies rambling on about Python only ilustrate the point I am making.

by gipp 3y ago

1vuio0pswjnm7 3y ago

There are HN commenters and people who blog about programming that attempt to argue against any statement that Python is slow.^1 This comment I am replying to is itself defensive. If Python is slow and everyone knows and accepts it as true then why does the statement "Python is slow" consistently trigger defensive comments. Why am I even having to bother typing this reply. Why would anyone care enough to make some "counterargument" if anyone states that Python is slow, or I state I am not using it because it is slow. Python is already an overwhelmingly popular language choice. 1. For example, https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31200989 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31200989 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35906158 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35906158 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22040899 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22040899 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16978932 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16978932 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31845729 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31845729

gipp 3y ago
?? In your links, I see either a) people responding because some commenter is being weirdly aggressive about an issue that is not controversial and that nobody is on the other side of (like me, responding to you, right now), or b) people pretty calmly and lucidly discussing the relative merits of small performance improvements vs the required development time, or increased complexity, or some other tradeoff. You know, engineering.
- 1vuio0pswjnm7 3y ago
  What you don't see is how many upvotes I got for stating that Python is slow. It would seem I am not the only one who notices the constant, absurd attempts to discount this simple fact. The title of this submission is "Bloated Google-cloud-CLI contains an entire Python installation (~300MB)" I avoid Python wherever possible.
  - gipp 3y ago
    > It would seem I am not the only one who notices the constant, absurd attempts to discount this simple fact. Or... they upvoted you because Python being slow is a simple, obvious, uncontroversial truth that nobody disagrees with? Do you understand that I'm not trying to disagree with you on that point? The point is not that you're wrong about Python being slow, it's that you're wrong that this is somehow a secret nobody wants to admit, and you're wrong that this is somehow an evil thing that Python should be shunned for. There are no "constant, absurd attempts to discount this simple fact." The discussions you linked aren't doing that, they're just talking about the relative cost and importance of improving that slowness. Python is slow because accepting slowness lets the language be simpler, more flexible, and sometimes more expressive. For some use cases, this is an excellent tradeoff. For other use cases it's a terrible one. I don't understand why you see this as some kind of moral crusade.
    - 1vuio0pswjnm7 3y ago
      "Python is slow." <--- HN commenters like "gipp" will be unable to control their urge to "defend" their favorite scripting language. They will interpet this statement to mean nonsense such as "this is somehow an evil thing that Python should be shunned for". They will treat this statement as an invitation to discuss the "tradeoffs" of Python. Let's try this one more time. "Python is slow. It's bloated. I do not use it." There is nothing about "secrets" or "evil" or "moral crusade" or some other hyperbolic nonsense. There is nothing to interpret. I do not care about Python's tradeoffs. I do not care why it is slow. More replies rambling on about Python only ilustrate the point I am making.