5 ms·

Given that the goal of the union is to organize the workers so they get better working conditions and pay and can't be arbitrarily fired, it seems to be working

by smackfu 15y ago

Given that the goal of the union is to organize the workers so they get better working conditions and pay and can't be arbitrarily fired, it seems to be working just fine. If you thought you were underpaid, and you unionized to get a better rate, I bet your customers would bitch about it too and blame the union. And at heart, your complaint is really that management did a poor job of negotiating a contract with the union.

robomartin 15y ago
I don't know why you were downvoted, I gave you on upvote. You are, of course, absolutely correct at some level. I think that in the vast majority of cases it isn't union membership that is evil but rather the union bosses and negotiators that set out to suck the blood right out of the businesses they deal with. It's no different than politics. The union bosses have a nice ride and want to keep it. If they keep providing for the membership they gain votes and stay in power. Damn the consequences. And, when you join unions with governments you have the perfect storm: sharks vs. weasels. The union negotiators are the sharks intent in obtaining as much as they can out of the government agency. The government folks want the votes from the union membership. So, they, effectively, pay them off to buy their votes by granting all kinds of insane things to the union sharks. How else would you have a librarian retire and be paid $250K a year for life? These costs, be them in the private domain or government have to come from somewhere. In the case of conferences it makes everything more expensive for attendees.
- huxley 15y ago
  Where do you live so I can get one of those sweet jobs? Jeez, the Dean of the University Libraries in University Of Southern California pulls down $250,000, but you do know that isn't really a common thing? Median salary for librarians is about $50,000, which isn't bad but not "retire on $250K for life".
  - MaysonL 15y ago
    University of Southern California (USC) is a private university.
    - huxley 15y ago
      Fair enough but my point was that if there are librarians that make $250,000 it is because they are at the highest level of administration over a library system, not the librarians that you meet at a reference desk. As eli_gottlieb pointed out, many librarian positions are unpaid so the $50K figure may significantly overestimate the salary of a librarian if volunteer ones are not counted.
  - eli_gottlieb 15y ago
    I don't know if that number is accurate. Many librarian positions are unpaid nowadays...
    - meej 15y ago
      I completed an MSLIS degree in 2008. My classmates who were bound for traditional library careers used to joke that the only masters-level degree that pays less after graduation is Social Work. The WSJ published a sortable table of unemployment and salaries by degree late last year. Library Science graduates currently face an unemployment rate of 15% in the field (4th highest, out of 173 degrees) and salaries that rank in the bottom 5 amongst all degrees. http://graphicsweb.wsj.com/documents/NILF1111/#term= http://graphicsweb.wsj.com/documents/NILF1111/#term=
  - smackfu 15y ago
    And "librarian" covers a whole lot of ground. Here is the UConn list of job families: http://www.hr.uconn.edu/employment_services/ucpea_salary.html http://www.hr.uconn.edu/employment_services/ucpea_salary.htm... A person you or I would call a librarian can be classed anywhere from UCP V to UCP X, which covers a salary range of $40k to $110k.

by smackfu 15y ago

robomartin 15y ago

I don't know why you were downvoted, I gave you on upvote. You are, of course, absolutely correct at some level. I think that in the vast majority of cases it isn't union membership that is evil but rather the union bosses and negotiators that set out to suck the blood right out of the businesses they deal with. It's no different than politics. The union bosses have a nice ride and want to keep it. If they keep providing for the membership they gain votes and stay in power. Damn the consequences. And, when you join unions with governments you have the perfect storm: sharks vs. weasels. The union negotiators are the sharks intent in obtaining as much as they can out of the government agency. The government folks want the votes from the union membership. So, they, effectively, pay them off to buy their votes by granting all kinds of insane things to the union sharks. How else would you have a librarian retire and be paid $250K a year for life? These costs, be them in the private domain or government have to come from somewhere. In the case of conferences it makes everything more expensive for attendees.

huxley 15y ago
Where do you live so I can get one of those sweet jobs? Jeez, the Dean of the University Libraries in University Of Southern California pulls down $250,000, but you do know that isn't really a common thing? Median salary for librarians is about $50,000, which isn't bad but not "retire on $250K for life".
- MaysonL 15y ago
  University of Southern California (USC) is a private university.
  - huxley 15y ago
    Fair enough but my point was that if there are librarians that make $250,000 it is because they are at the highest level of administration over a library system, not the librarians that you meet at a reference desk. As eli_gottlieb pointed out, many librarian positions are unpaid so the $50K figure may significantly overestimate the salary of a librarian if volunteer ones are not counted.
- eli_gottlieb 15y ago
  I don't know if that number is accurate. Many librarian positions are unpaid nowadays...
  - meej 15y ago
    I completed an MSLIS degree in 2008. My classmates who were bound for traditional library careers used to joke that the only masters-level degree that pays less after graduation is Social Work. The WSJ published a sortable table of unemployment and salaries by degree late last year. Library Science graduates currently face an unemployment rate of 15% in the field (4th highest, out of 173 degrees) and salaries that rank in the bottom 5 amongst all degrees. http://graphicsweb.wsj.com/documents/NILF1111/#term= http://graphicsweb.wsj.com/documents/NILF1111/#term=
- smackfu 15y ago
  And "librarian" covers a whole lot of ground. Here is the UConn list of job families: http://www.hr.uconn.edu/employment_services/ucpea_salary.html http://www.hr.uconn.edu/employment_services/ucpea_salary.htm... A person you or I would call a librarian can be classed anywhere from UCP V to UCP X, which covers a salary range of $40k to $110k.