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> many not tech-savvy people prefer it because of its ease of use. You realize how much you're hurting your argument when saying this? iPhones are in no way “

> many not tech-savvy people prefer it because of its ease of use. You realize how much you're hurting your argument when saying this? iPhones are in no way “easier to use” than Android phones, if anything the lack of a back button and more limited Windows support makes it marginally harder for beginner to use but that's not hard to overcome either so it's not a deal breaker in any way. But it's not easier, except in Apple's marketing pitch and Apple fan's head. The only thing saying things like this shows it that's you're an Apple fan whose PoV is too biased to be worth reading.

mrtksn 3y ago
It’s very hard to understand what Android’s up to because it can do anything. Also, you can’t tell what the back button will do - is it going to close the app or go back? On the other hand iPhones are very predictable. There’s one button or one gesture that takes you home and one gesture to take you back. Also, apps always stay with their limits, don’t blend in the OS beyond notifications,widgets and playback controls. That’s also part of the reason why Apple wants to keep it as a walled garden. iPhone’s are miles ahead of any Android in ease of use. Once you deep dive, they might be about the same but Apple still has the consistency advantage.
- ActorNightly 3y ago
  This argument of UI design needs to die a quick death. The fact is, no matter what interface you use, you are going to become accustomed to it, and over time you are going to be just as efficient at doing stuff. I can easily make arguments about iPhone shitty notification system compared Android, or lack of easily accessible settings, but we both know that people who use the iPhone don't really have an issue with it. This is the same "vim vs IDE" pointless arguments that people used to have.
  - mrtksn 3y ago
    Doing more things is not about ease of use. The notification example is horrible, why would you do more things in the notification beyond immediately reacting(an action like reply) to it? If you do more, it's not a notification its a widget that is presented in a list and this makes it 10x harder to use instantly because it breaks concept of notifications. Can be useful in certain workflows but this doesn't make it easier to use, it makes it versatile which can be good if you are willing to deal with the added complexity.
- littlestymaar 3y ago
  > Also, you can’t tell what the back button will do - is it going to close the app or go back? I've yet to encounter a single app that “closes” when pressing the back button… > or one gesture that takes you home and one gesture to take you back. And while gestures are ok in terms of UX, they aren't discoverable at all, hence my argument about bigger barrier to entry for beginner with iOS. > That’s also part of the reason why Apple wants to keep it as a walled garden. Nope, the reason is a mix of company's culture and profit motive. Since job's death Apple has largely departed from its former design consistency obsession. > Once you deep dive, they might be about the same but Apple still has the consistency advantage. The consistency advantage Apple has only exist compared to different Android phones (jumping from one Android brand/OS version to another is generally confusing), but it only matters when you change phones, and people have refrained to upgrade their iPhones to newer iOS version for years now so jumping to a new iPhone also come with a feeling of confusion if you were used to a former iOS version. As I said before, most of what you're talking about doesn't really exist except on Apple's marketing and fanbase mind.
  - mrtksn 3y ago
    >I've yet to encounter a single app that “closes” when pressing the back button… Here is how to reproduce: Tap back button until the app closes. Oh you will say that the app didn't close, it went into the background? Maybe, maybe not - users can't tell without further investigation. This alone makes it 10x harder to use than iPhone. On iPhone, there's no concept of closing the app. Well, there's but its not a relevant thing %99 of the time because apps are very limited on what they can do in the background and its very obvious if the are doing something(you see controls on the screen because they will have to use some system service like playing audio).
    - littlestymaar 3y ago
      > Oh you will say that the app didn't close, it went into the background? Maybe, maybe not - users can't tell without further investigation. As I said, I've never encountered the “maybe not” option, so I'm suspecting you're making stuff up again… > This alone makes it 10x harder to use than iPhone. Come on. You realize you're embarrassing yourself, don't you?
Our_Benefactors 3y ago
> iPhones are in no way “easier to use” than Android phones Sorry, this is just delusional. Android has no unified standard for how the OS is implemented between devices. Every time you get a new android phone, you need to relearn new UI quirks specific to that device. I honestly don't know how someone could claim with a straight face that Android is easier to use than iPhone.
- ActorNightly 3y ago
  Why make stuff up? All android phones have the home screens, the bottom app drawer, the app switcher, and the top drop down menu for quick settings. The only big differences between Android phones are extra features that a phone may have. For example, Pixel has a bunch of interactions you can do with it that you can't do with other phones.
  - littlestymaar 3y ago
    > Why make stuff up? Because Apple is a religion[1], that's it. Worshipers will say whatever it takes to defend their cult, that's basic human psychology. [1]: https://www.zdnet.com/article/anthropologist-confirms-apple-is-a-religion/ https://www.zdnet.com/article/anthropologist-confirms-apple-...
  - Our_Benefactors 3y ago
    All android phones can implement whatever menu structure, app icons, and other flavors on top of the OS - Samsungs implementations being notoriously hated. That some minor bits are consistent across the platform doesn’t fix this. There’s also the fact that android App Store has a far worse shovelware issue.
- littlestymaar 3y ago
  > Every time you get a new android phone, you need to relearn new UI quirks specific to that device. “Everytime” is in fact every 3+ years in average! At this rate, even iOS changes its UX in a way you need to learn new stuff, and that's fine. And while there are undeniable differences from one device to another, it's a completely pointless metric! For the user the only thing that matter is what happens on your device. Pretty much no-one cares if their neighbors' phone is the same as their own, what matters is how easy it is to use your phone. Also I can tell you, as an Android user, it's orders of magnitude easier to use any other people's Android phone than it is to use an iPhone with its undiscoverable hand snaps to get to the previous screen! Long term iPhone users (and MacOs users for that matter) have internalized the idiosyncrasies of their platform, and forgotten that there's actually an non-trivial learning process. Obviously it's “much simpler” once you've already learned it, it's the kind of statements people make about the command line as well…
deleted 3y ago
[deleted]

mrtksn 3y ago

It’s very hard to understand what Android’s up to because it can do anything. Also, you can’t tell what the back button will do - is it going to close the app or go back? On the other hand iPhones are very predictable. There’s one button or one gesture that takes you home and one gesture to take you back. Also, apps always stay with their limits, don’t blend in the OS beyond notifications,widgets and playback controls. That’s also part of the reason why Apple wants to keep it as a walled garden. iPhone’s are miles ahead of any Android in ease of use. Once you deep dive, they might be about the same but Apple still has the consistency advantage.

ActorNightly 3y ago
This argument of UI design needs to die a quick death. The fact is, no matter what interface you use, you are going to become accustomed to it, and over time you are going to be just as efficient at doing stuff. I can easily make arguments about iPhone shitty notification system compared Android, or lack of easily accessible settings, but we both know that people who use the iPhone don't really have an issue with it. This is the same "vim vs IDE" pointless arguments that people used to have.
- mrtksn 3y ago
  Doing more things is not about ease of use. The notification example is horrible, why would you do more things in the notification beyond immediately reacting(an action like reply) to it? If you do more, it's not a notification its a widget that is presented in a list and this makes it 10x harder to use instantly because it breaks concept of notifications. Can be useful in certain workflows but this doesn't make it easier to use, it makes it versatile which can be good if you are willing to deal with the added complexity.
littlestymaar 3y ago
> Also, you can’t tell what the back button will do - is it going to close the app or go back? I've yet to encounter a single app that “closes” when pressing the back button… > or one gesture that takes you home and one gesture to take you back. And while gestures are ok in terms of UX, they aren't discoverable at all, hence my argument about bigger barrier to entry for beginner with iOS. > That’s also part of the reason why Apple wants to keep it as a walled garden. Nope, the reason is a mix of company's culture and profit motive. Since job's death Apple has largely departed from its former design consistency obsession. > Once you deep dive, they might be about the same but Apple still has the consistency advantage. The consistency advantage Apple has only exist compared to different Android phones (jumping from one Android brand/OS version to another is generally confusing), but it only matters when you change phones, and people have refrained to upgrade their iPhones to newer iOS version for years now so jumping to a new iPhone also come with a feeling of confusion if you were used to a former iOS version. As I said before, most of what you're talking about doesn't really exist except on Apple's marketing and fanbase mind.
- mrtksn 3y ago
  >I've yet to encounter a single app that “closes” when pressing the back button… Here is how to reproduce: Tap back button until the app closes. Oh you will say that the app didn't close, it went into the background? Maybe, maybe not - users can't tell without further investigation. This alone makes it 10x harder to use than iPhone. On iPhone, there's no concept of closing the app. Well, there's but its not a relevant thing %99 of the time because apps are very limited on what they can do in the background and its very obvious if the are doing something(you see controls on the screen because they will have to use some system service like playing audio).
  - littlestymaar 3y ago
    > Oh you will say that the app didn't close, it went into the background? Maybe, maybe not - users can't tell without further investigation. As I said, I've never encountered the “maybe not” option, so I'm suspecting you're making stuff up again… > This alone makes it 10x harder to use than iPhone. Come on. You realize you're embarrassing yourself, don't you?

Our_Benefactors 3y ago

> iPhones are in no way “easier to use” than Android phones Sorry, this is just delusional. Android has no unified standard for how the OS is implemented between devices. Every time you get a new android phone, you need to relearn new UI quirks specific to that device. I honestly don't know how someone could claim with a straight face that Android is easier to use than iPhone.

ActorNightly 3y ago
Why make stuff up? All android phones have the home screens, the bottom app drawer, the app switcher, and the top drop down menu for quick settings. The only big differences between Android phones are extra features that a phone may have. For example, Pixel has a bunch of interactions you can do with it that you can't do with other phones.
- littlestymaar 3y ago
  > Why make stuff up? Because Apple is a religion[1], that's it. Worshipers will say whatever it takes to defend their cult, that's basic human psychology. [1]: https://www.zdnet.com/article/anthropologist-confirms-apple-is-a-religion/ https://www.zdnet.com/article/anthropologist-confirms-apple-...
- Our_Benefactors 3y ago
  All android phones can implement whatever menu structure, app icons, and other flavors on top of the OS - Samsungs implementations being notoriously hated. That some minor bits are consistent across the platform doesn’t fix this. There’s also the fact that android App Store has a far worse shovelware issue.
littlestymaar 3y ago
> Every time you get a new android phone, you need to relearn new UI quirks specific to that device. “Everytime” is in fact every 3+ years in average! At this rate, even iOS changes its UX in a way you need to learn new stuff, and that's fine. And while there are undeniable differences from one device to another, it's a completely pointless metric! For the user the only thing that matter is what happens on your device. Pretty much no-one cares if their neighbors' phone is the same as their own, what matters is how easy it is to use your phone. Also I can tell you, as an Android user, it's orders of magnitude easier to use any other people's Android phone than it is to use an iPhone with its undiscoverable hand snaps to get to the previous screen! Long term iPhone users (and MacOs users for that matter) have internalized the idiosyncrasies of their platform, and forgotten that there's actually an non-trivial learning process. Obviously it's “much simpler” once you've already learned it, it's the kind of statements people make about the command line as well…

deleted 3y ago

[deleted]