4 ms·

> for thousands of years before they were colonized had this figured out Yes, it is outrageous that we can't directly apply the same policies and methods consi

> for thousands of years before they were colonized had this figured out Yes, it is outrageous that we can't directly apply the same policies and methods considering we have the same level of urbanization, population, industrial and economic requirements and private property laws /s

davidw 3y ago
IDK about 'outrageous', but it is kind of frustrating it has taken us so long to figure out that the people who lived here knew what they were doing, and adapting their methods to our current society.
- maximinus_thrax 3y ago
  On the ranking of frustrations regarding wildfires and climate change, not doing controlled burns (like the native peoples were doing) is really really low for me, especially considering all the things I just listed.
  - davidw 3y ago
    I live in a place with a huge national forest just to the west, so for me it is a real concern. The speed with which this fire ripped through was no joke, as an example: https://www.bendbulletin.com/localstate/awbrey-hall-fire-20-years-later/article_f1870f2b-cc50-5ec1-9795-97157101623f.html https://www.bendbulletin.com/localstate/awbrey-hall-fire-20-... And the city got lucky because the wind was out of the NW, rather than from the west, which might have driven it straight into the city.
    - maximinus_thrax 3y ago
      So do you believe that the lack of controlled burning is the issue here or is it > I live in a place with a huge national forest just to the west ? I think the urban sprawl is more to blame here. It's not that we as a society have forgotten about controlled burning or we've become so 'weak' and 'librul' that we don't do what needs to be done. There is a risk here (for example https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Calf_Canyon/Hermits_Peak_Fire https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Calf_Canyon/Hermits_Peak_Fire) and nobody wants to take responsibility over something which may cause immediate deaths or loses of property vs something which may or may not happen in the future. Sure, it's kicking the can down the road but who exactly is to blame for cities built right next to forests? I have a huge issue with bringing up controlled burning as it is ALWAYS used as an argument against the obvious human created climate change. 'Hey, just burn the forest fuel from time to time, no big deal', etc..
- drone 3y ago
  It hasn't "taken us this long to figure out..." the issues around prescribed burning are fairly modern and related to overreacting/incorrectly responding to some major wildfires that killed lots of people in the late 19th and early 20th century. (See the formation of the USFS and the policies promoted by them, Smoky the Bear, etc.) Fire was a regular tool in everyone in North America's toolkit, indigenous or otherwise, and not something white people were too stupid to figure out.
ToucanLoucan 3y ago
[flagged]
- maximinus_thrax 3y ago
  > If our industrial and economic requirements and private property laws prevent us from maintaining a planet we can live on, what fucking good are they? I share the same view with you. But we are the minority, just FYI. I've expressed these sentiments in public and every single time I've been labeled a tree hugging commie. This event https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2021_Western_North_America_heat_wave https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2021_Western_North_America_hea... radicalized me.
  - ToucanLoucan 3y ago
    [flagged]

davidw 3y ago

IDK about 'outrageous', but it is kind of frustrating it has taken us so long to figure out that the people who lived here knew what they were doing, and adapting their methods to our current society.

maximinus_thrax 3y ago
On the ranking of frustrations regarding wildfires and climate change, not doing controlled burns (like the native peoples were doing) is really really low for me, especially considering all the things I just listed.
- davidw 3y ago
  I live in a place with a huge national forest just to the west, so for me it is a real concern. The speed with which this fire ripped through was no joke, as an example: https://www.bendbulletin.com/localstate/awbrey-hall-fire-20-years-later/article_f1870f2b-cc50-5ec1-9795-97157101623f.html https://www.bendbulletin.com/localstate/awbrey-hall-fire-20-... And the city got lucky because the wind was out of the NW, rather than from the west, which might have driven it straight into the city.
  - maximinus_thrax 3y ago
    So do you believe that the lack of controlled burning is the issue here or is it > I live in a place with a huge national forest just to the west ? I think the urban sprawl is more to blame here. It's not that we as a society have forgotten about controlled burning or we've become so 'weak' and 'librul' that we don't do what needs to be done. There is a risk here (for example https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Calf_Canyon/Hermits_Peak_Fire https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Calf_Canyon/Hermits_Peak_Fire) and nobody wants to take responsibility over something which may cause immediate deaths or loses of property vs something which may or may not happen in the future. Sure, it's kicking the can down the road but who exactly is to blame for cities built right next to forests? I have a huge issue with bringing up controlled burning as it is ALWAYS used as an argument against the obvious human created climate change. 'Hey, just burn the forest fuel from time to time, no big deal', etc..
drone 3y ago
It hasn't "taken us this long to figure out..." the issues around prescribed burning are fairly modern and related to overreacting/incorrectly responding to some major wildfires that killed lots of people in the late 19th and early 20th century. (See the formation of the USFS and the policies promoted by them, Smoky the Bear, etc.) Fire was a regular tool in everyone in North America's toolkit, indigenous or otherwise, and not something white people were too stupid to figure out.

ToucanLoucan 3y ago

[flagged]

maximinus_thrax 3y ago
> If our industrial and economic requirements and private property laws prevent us from maintaining a planet we can live on, what fucking good are they? I share the same view with you. But we are the minority, just FYI. I've expressed these sentiments in public and every single time I've been labeled a tree hugging commie. This event https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2021_Western_North_America_heat_wave https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2021_Western_North_America_hea... radicalized me.
- ToucanLoucan 3y ago
  [flagged]