3 ms·

Surely 'pickpocket' is that way because (there) 'pick' is a verb, not a noun? Like.. 'roast potato' or 'tryhard'. (To deviate way off course, isn't it also odd

by OJFord 3y ago

Surely 'pickpocket' is that way because (there) 'pick' is a verb, not a noun? Like.. 'roast potato' or 'tryhard'. (To deviate way off course, isn't it also odd we don't say 'roasted potato', or 'roasted chicken', etc.? Or not in that context anyway, only if it was something like 'mashed or roasted?')

thaumasiotes 3y ago
> Surely 'pickpocket' is that way because (there) 'pick' is a verb, not a noun? Like.. 'roast potato' or 'tryhard'. No, the normal thing to do in modern English is to say "pocket picker"†, where the head of the phrase comes after the modifier. As you note, the other order remains possible in non-archaic forms ("tryhard", "kiss-ass"), but it is unusual. "Roast potato" is already right-headed; it is a kind of potato, not a kind of roasting or an entity characterized by its practice of roasting. † That is, the normal way to express this kind of concept, not the normal way to express the particular concept of a pickpocket, where a conventional word already exists.
- OJFord 3y ago
  Yeah ok roast potato was a bad (not a) example, I got hung up searching for a verb+noun one and lost track. 'pocket picker' illustrates my point though, you swapped the verb for noun form, and it became the other way around. 'kiss-ass' is the same again, or at least it arguably is. (And I would argue it: it alleges a person to be one who 'kisses ass', not who is the kiss on the ass itself.)
  - thaumasiotes 3y ago
    > 'pocket picker' illustrates my point though, you swapped the verb for noun form, and it became the other way around. No, "pickpocket" is already a noun, and it means "pocket picker". Just like "kiss-ass".
    - OJFord 3y ago
      'picker' compounded in 'pocket picker' is a noun, and 'pick' compounded in 'pickpocket' is a verb. 'kiss' ...
      - thaumasiotes 3y ago
        Suppose you want to describe someone by the action they perform. There is a normal way to do this, and "pocket picker" is an example of it. There is also an extremely marked, almost-never-used way to do it, and "pickpocket" is an example of that. What are you trying to say?

by OJFord 3y ago

thaumasiotes 3y ago

> Surely 'pickpocket' is that way because (there) 'pick' is a verb, not a noun? Like.. 'roast potato' or 'tryhard'. No, the normal thing to do in modern English is to say "pocket picker"†, where the head of the phrase comes after the modifier. As you note, the other order remains possible in non-archaic forms ("tryhard", "kiss-ass"), but it is unusual. "Roast potato" is already right-headed; it is a kind of potato, not a kind of roasting or an entity characterized by its practice of roasting. † That is, the normal way to express this kind of concept, not the normal way to express the particular concept of a pickpocket, where a conventional word already exists.

OJFord 3y ago
Yeah ok roast potato was a bad (not a) example, I got hung up searching for a verb+noun one and lost track. 'pocket picker' illustrates my point though, you swapped the verb for noun form, and it became the other way around. 'kiss-ass' is the same again, or at least it arguably is. (And I would argue it: it alleges a person to be one who 'kisses ass', not who is the kiss on the ass itself.)
- thaumasiotes 3y ago
  > 'pocket picker' illustrates my point though, you swapped the verb for noun form, and it became the other way around. No, "pickpocket" is already a noun, and it means "pocket picker". Just like "kiss-ass".
  - OJFord 3y ago
    'picker' compounded in 'pocket picker' is a noun, and 'pick' compounded in 'pickpocket' is a verb. 'kiss' ...
    - thaumasiotes 3y ago
      Suppose you want to describe someone by the action they perform. There is a normal way to do this, and "pocket picker" is an example of it. There is also an extremely marked, almost-never-used way to do it, and "pickpocket" is an example of that. What are you trying to say?