4 ms·

I don't have nor want/have any desire for kids, yet all the people with kids keep telling me I should, and not having them is selfish (...how? Isn't it the othe

I don't have nor want/have any desire for kids, yet all the people with kids keep telling me I should, and not having them is selfish (...how? Isn't it the other way around?), and multitude of other reasons why I should definitely have them and that if I don't then I'm somehow a horrible person. What I don't get is why people keep forcing their lifestyle onto those with a different lifestyle? Do they see me having all this free time and get jealous and want me to spend the best years of my life also stressing out and raising kids or why is that?

cpursley 3y ago
I’ve done all the “lifestyle” stuff as well. We’re not jealous. Kids are an order of magnitude more rewarding.
- cpursley 3y ago
  And here’s the secret: when the kids are a bit older, they can participate in your lifestyle: travel, skiing, instruments, etc.
  - askonomm 3y ago
    No thanks. Don't like kids.
  - prmoustache 3y ago
    Funny how the OP just complained about the social pressure and then people like you can't refrain from adding on top of it. I have kids, I love them, I love parts of what having kids is about, and I hate other parts. If for some reason I had to hit rewind, I would probably choose it without having kids with the information I gained over the years. And I totally understand people not wanting kids.
  - drukenemo 3y ago
    That’s assuming they will like you what you like.
- askonomm 3y ago
  My "lifestyle" is just having more time for my hobbies and entertainment with a lot less stress, so I figure for you kids are more rewarding than those things, but to me (and a lot of other people like me) they are not.
the_third_wave 3y ago
No, it is not the other way around, how could it? Had your parents not had you you would not have been able to voice your opinion on this subject. Were your parents selfish when they did so? If is not a 'lifestyle' thing to have children, rather the opposite: not having children is a 'lack of life' style. If enough people take up this 'lack of life' style your culture will die out and be replaced with one where having children is the norm. This is not a value proposition but simple math - every couple needs to have ~2.1 children to keep the population at a steady level [1]. Also, 'they' do not see you having all this free time and get jealous, they notice that you're spending time on hedonistic pursuits while time is running out - there is a set time frame within which having children is a viable proposition. They are not jealous of your free time at all because from their perspective it is wasted time - time which could be spent with your family instead of just by yourself or with your partner. Does this mean you are a horrible person for not wanting to have children? No, of course it does not. Not everybody is brought into this world to raise children. It does mean you are missing out on one of the most formational experiences life has to offer, all that free time you gain does come at a certain cost. The choice is yours to make due to the advent of birth control - choose wisely. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_total_fertility_rate https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_total_fer...
- prmoustache 3y ago
  > Also, 'they' do not see you having all this free time and get jealous, they notice that you're spending time on hedonistic pursuits while time is running out - there is a set time frame within which having children is a viable proposition. They are not jealous of your free time at all because from their perspective it is wasted time - time which could be spent with your family instead of just by yourself or with your partner. Yes some are. This is incredibly inpopular to articulate it out loud but there is a large enough proportion of parents who regret having kids. And that doesn't mean they don't love their kids.

cpursley 3y ago

I’ve done all the “lifestyle” stuff as well. We’re not jealous. Kids are an order of magnitude more rewarding.

cpursley 3y ago
And here’s the secret: when the kids are a bit older, they can participate in your lifestyle: travel, skiing, instruments, etc.
- askonomm 3y ago
  No thanks. Don't like kids.
- prmoustache 3y ago
  Funny how the OP just complained about the social pressure and then people like you can't refrain from adding on top of it. I have kids, I love them, I love parts of what having kids is about, and I hate other parts. If for some reason I had to hit rewind, I would probably choose it without having kids with the information I gained over the years. And I totally understand people not wanting kids.
- drukenemo 3y ago
  That’s assuming they will like you what you like.
askonomm 3y ago
My "lifestyle" is just having more time for my hobbies and entertainment with a lot less stress, so I figure for you kids are more rewarding than those things, but to me (and a lot of other people like me) they are not.

the_third_wave 3y ago

No, it is not the other way around, how could it? Had your parents not had you you would not have been able to voice your opinion on this subject. Were your parents selfish when they did so? If is not a 'lifestyle' thing to have children, rather the opposite: not having children is a 'lack of life' style. If enough people take up this 'lack of life' style your culture will die out and be replaced with one where having children is the norm. This is not a value proposition but simple math - every couple needs to have ~2.1 children to keep the population at a steady level [1]. Also, 'they' do not see you having all this free time and get jealous, they notice that you're spending time on hedonistic pursuits while time is running out - there is a set time frame within which having children is a viable proposition. They are not jealous of your free time at all because from their perspective it is wasted time - time which could be spent with your family instead of just by yourself or with your partner. Does this mean you are a horrible person for not wanting to have children? No, of course it does not. Not everybody is brought into this world to raise children. It does mean you are missing out on one of the most formational experiences life has to offer, all that free time you gain does come at a certain cost. The choice is yours to make due to the advent of birth control - choose wisely. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_total_fertility_rate https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_total_fer...

prmoustache 3y ago
> Also, 'they' do not see you having all this free time and get jealous, they notice that you're spending time on hedonistic pursuits while time is running out - there is a set time frame within which having children is a viable proposition. They are not jealous of your free time at all because from their perspective it is wasted time - time which could be spent with your family instead of just by yourself or with your partner. Yes some are. This is incredibly inpopular to articulate it out loud but there is a large enough proportion of parents who regret having kids. And that doesn't mean they don't love their kids.