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Writing complete and correct code takes a lot of engineering time and money. The aerospace industry does it and the price tag matches. Imagine how much innovati

Writing complete and correct code takes a lot of engineering time and money. The aerospace industry does it and the price tag matches. Imagine how much innovation we would have missed out on if we demanded perfection from every product over the last 60 years

Jtsummers 3y ago
The aerospace industry does not write complete and correct code. Hate to terrify you, but it's true. Some companies do, some specific areas do. Most are just a step or two above the software industry average in terms of quality, which is not that stellar. They don't get there by using a lot of formal methods or thinking deeply. They get there by testing the shit out of everything and static analysis tools (which have gotten a ton better since I started in the industry). Some of the programmers I've had to clean up after were mediocre, at best (though others were stellar). The main reason their systems don't kill people is the testers standing between you and their original code. MBSE has been picking up, and it's a good thing. It's not as big as it should be or always used effectively, but it's helping.
fransje26 3y ago
> Imagine how much innovation we would have missed out on if we demanded perfection from every product over the last 60 years Very ironic to have such a take when the very industry brought up is arguably the one that brought the most innovation of the post-war era. From metal alloys to electronics, plastics, composits, wireless transmission, precision machining, quality standards and traceability.
- pythonguython 3y ago
  I don’t consider it ironic. My opinion is that both fast paced development and careful rigorous development can produce innovation, but often of a different kind. You can have both and they don’t have to negate each other. The development pace at companies like Google have contributed to changing the world just like NASA has

Jtsummers 3y ago

The aerospace industry does not write complete and correct code. Hate to terrify you, but it's true. Some companies do, some specific areas do. Most are just a step or two above the software industry average in terms of quality, which is not that stellar. They don't get there by using a lot of formal methods or thinking deeply. They get there by testing the shit out of everything and static analysis tools (which have gotten a ton better since I started in the industry). Some of the programmers I've had to clean up after were mediocre, at best (though others were stellar). The main reason their systems don't kill people is the testers standing between you and their original code. MBSE has been picking up, and it's a good thing. It's not as big as it should be or always used effectively, but it's helping.

fransje26 3y ago

> Imagine how much innovation we would have missed out on if we demanded perfection from every product over the last 60 years Very ironic to have such a take when the very industry brought up is arguably the one that brought the most innovation of the post-war era. From metal alloys to electronics, plastics, composits, wireless transmission, precision machining, quality standards and traceability.

pythonguython 3y ago
I don’t consider it ironic. My opinion is that both fast paced development and careful rigorous development can produce innovation, but often of a different kind. You can have both and they don’t have to negate each other. The development pace at companies like Google have contributed to changing the world just like NASA has