4 ms·

Yeah he deliberately hammed it up for his book with this stuff, and he probably couldn't have made a name for himself if he didn't. I remember the talk show int

Yeah he deliberately hammed it up for his book with this stuff, and he probably couldn't have made a name for himself if he didn't. I remember the talk show interviews in which he gave the "never order fish on a Monday" thing, as if the fish at most people's grocery stores was even remotely as fresh as the fish at a Manhattan restaurant on Monday. Me and many other restaurant workers I knew were annoyed by his sensationalizing this. But I've never met any of them that didn't happily forgive him for deftly portraying the insane grit, discrimination, drug use, shadiness, and abuse in the restaurant industry while also portraying the beauty, passion, creativity and humanity of it. He definitely ended up being one of the most positive elements in that world.

delichon 3y ago
Unfortunately his tendency to dramatize and catastrophize either came with his depression, contributed to it, or both. He suffered for his art to our benefit. I wonder, if he was chill enough to survive, would we know his name?
- chefandy 3y ago
  He also knew how to deliberately be a jackass for effect, which is a survival skill in commercial kitchens when paired with a thick skin. Fundamental emotional issues aside, I do know that his outward-facing persona was prone to being rather flamboyant well before he was a celebrity-- which he implied in his books. One of my teachers in culinary school was a cook in P-town while Bourdain was a teenager working his first kitchen jobs, and even then, pretty much everybody in the local industry knew who he was. Generally well liked but known as a serious party animal. P-town does have a heck of a party culture and I imagine I'd have taken a very different, and much more substance-focused path had I worked summers there as a teen line cook.
  - jjtheblunt 3y ago
    What's P-town?
    - 5555624 3y ago
      Provincetown, Massachusetts
    - chefandy 3y ago
      Oh sorry, 5555 is right— it's Provincetown, MA.
      - tomcam 3y ago
        Not to be confused with A-town
alexjplant 3y ago
> Me and many other restaurant workers I knew were annoyed by his sensationalizing this. But I've never met any of them that didn't happily forgive him I know at least one professional chef who didn't. They also supposedly ran into him in the city a few years before this article was written and said that he was, to paraphrase, not an especially nice person. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ I've only ever been on the periphery of the industry so I can't really judge. I have, however, worked with enough intensely-talented people to know that intense personality traits are sometimes par for the course. If you can't separate the art from the artist at least _some_ of the time then you'll run dry of things to enjoy.
- chefandy 3y ago
  I've known a number of people who ran into him that said he was really chill, but who knows. Most really toxic dickheads are really great at putting on the nice guy show when it benefits them. That said, everybody has bad days, and it's pretty clear he had some giant mental health issues to contend with. I have too, and while I've always been more of a social harmony type, I hope there aren't too many that judge me based on my worst days. I imagine the people that actually worked for him would probably know best, and given his status, I doubt someone that had terrible experiences would be particularly willing to step forward. I will say though that I heard a lot of really negative shit about Mario Batalli a-decade-and-a-half before he was publicly shamed for it, and never the same for Bourdain.
OJFord 3y ago
> I remember the talk show interviews in which he gave the "never order fish on a Monday" thing, as if the fish at most people's grocery stores was even remotely as fresh as the fish at a Manhattan restaurant on Monday. In the article at least though, his argument actually isn't that it's not a fresh catch (which is the advice I've heard before, not attributed to him) but rather that it's spent a few days in the kitchen (because there won't have been a delivery) and so it's seen too much temperature fluctuation & co-mingled with various meats. I don't know if it is or was an issue or not, or as commonly true as he claimed, but the point doesn't seem to be about taste, so how old what we 'freshly buy' from a supermarket is isn't really relevant.

delichon 3y ago

Unfortunately his tendency to dramatize and catastrophize either came with his depression, contributed to it, or both. He suffered for his art to our benefit. I wonder, if he was chill enough to survive, would we know his name?

chefandy 3y ago
He also knew how to deliberately be a jackass for effect, which is a survival skill in commercial kitchens when paired with a thick skin. Fundamental emotional issues aside, I do know that his outward-facing persona was prone to being rather flamboyant well before he was a celebrity-- which he implied in his books. One of my teachers in culinary school was a cook in P-town while Bourdain was a teenager working his first kitchen jobs, and even then, pretty much everybody in the local industry knew who he was. Generally well liked but known as a serious party animal. P-town does have a heck of a party culture and I imagine I'd have taken a very different, and much more substance-focused path had I worked summers there as a teen line cook.
- jjtheblunt 3y ago
  What's P-town?
  - 5555624 3y ago
    Provincetown, Massachusetts
  - chefandy 3y ago
    Oh sorry, 5555 is right— it's Provincetown, MA.
    - tomcam 3y ago
      Not to be confused with A-town

alexjplant 3y ago

> Me and many other restaurant workers I knew were annoyed by his sensationalizing this. But I've never met any of them that didn't happily forgive him I know at least one professional chef who didn't. They also supposedly ran into him in the city a few years before this article was written and said that he was, to paraphrase, not an especially nice person. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ I've only ever been on the periphery of the industry so I can't really judge. I have, however, worked with enough intensely-talented people to know that intense personality traits are sometimes par for the course. If you can't separate the art from the artist at least _some_ of the time then you'll run dry of things to enjoy.

chefandy 3y ago
I've known a number of people who ran into him that said he was really chill, but who knows. Most really toxic dickheads are really great at putting on the nice guy show when it benefits them. That said, everybody has bad days, and it's pretty clear he had some giant mental health issues to contend with. I have too, and while I've always been more of a social harmony type, I hope there aren't too many that judge me based on my worst days. I imagine the people that actually worked for him would probably know best, and given his status, I doubt someone that had terrible experiences would be particularly willing to step forward. I will say though that I heard a lot of really negative shit about Mario Batalli a-decade-and-a-half before he was publicly shamed for it, and never the same for Bourdain.

OJFord 3y ago

> I remember the talk show interviews in which he gave the "never order fish on a Monday" thing, as if the fish at most people's grocery stores was even remotely as fresh as the fish at a Manhattan restaurant on Monday. In the article at least though, his argument actually isn't that it's not a fresh catch (which is the advice I've heard before, not attributed to him) but rather that it's spent a few days in the kitchen (because there won't have been a delivery) and so it's seen too much temperature fluctuation & co-mingled with various meats. I don't know if it is or was an issue or not, or as commonly true as he claimed, but the point doesn't seem to be about taste, so how old what we 'freshly buy' from a supermarket is isn't really relevant.