7 ms·

Supply is also constrained since the league is effectively a cartel controlling supply (only so many teams are allowed)

by NegativeLatency 3y ago

vidanay 3y ago
Is there a professional sports league anywhere that is not the same?
- OJFord 3y ago
  GP's not saying it negatively/judgementally I don't think, it's sort of a term of art in business finance: https://www.investopedia.com/terms/c/cartel.asp https://www.investopedia.com/terms/c/cartel.asp (I say sort of because you could say it's the same word same definition just perhaps used more literally. But it certainly has a connotation to most of us that I think is how you're reading it above.)
- elygre 3y ago
  In many European soccer leagues, the league does not control the participants in the same way. You can start a club, and start climbing to the top.
  - mcny 3y ago
    Yes, the fact that there is no relegation/promotion is strange.
    - votepaunchy 3y ago
      Only strange that the biggest European clubs failed to breakaway into their own Super League without pro/rel. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_Super_League https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_Super_League
- charcircuit 3y ago
  There are plenty in esports.
jrockway 3y ago
Didn't Fox start a new football league this year? I think the NFL is more of an entrenched business with great brand recognition than a cartel. College football players want an NFL contract because they trust that the NFL will be around in 10 years. (Same reason that CS grads want to work for Google and not a random startup; Google will be around in 5 years.) This means that the NFL gets first pick on the most talented players. That is what prevents upstart leagues from being successful. Players have seen what happened to competing leagues; their counterparts are now unemployed. Without good players, nobody is going to watch your thing, and thus, the NFL will continue to dominate. I think that with an infinite amount of money, you could probably create a new football league for a new generation. You will need billions of dollars to build 32 new stadiums. You will need billions of dollars to pay Patrick Mahomes $500M a year to switch sides. (x32 teams x53 players on the roster = 800 billion dollars a year in salary costs ;) Because nobody has an infinite amount of money, it's not really going to happen that way. I bet you could woo a number of viewers over by having a sane online streaming package. I want to watch every game in the season for a fixed price. No blackouts. No ads. No delay.
- rsync 3y ago
  The NFL has an exemption from the Sherman antitrust act. Therefore, we need not argue about whether they are or are not a cartel - or are engaging in anti-competitive behavior: our government has already defined them as such.
  - jrockway 3y ago
    It's somewhat unclear if they even need the exemption. It's only relevant to TV licensing deals, and TV ain't what it used to be. The NFL mostly exists to keep the dying TV business alive, but nobody actually wants to watch the NFL on TV. If the TV deals were ruled illegal, the NFL would live and the TV stations would die.
    - thehoff 3y ago
      Maybe but I doubt the NFL would continue on the way it does without TV. They must make a ton off networks who then make it back via advertising, but maybe I’m wrong. My group of friends and I definitely watch and don’t go to games because of the cost (we would not go to games just because they are not in TV). College football around here is much more affordable (as are college basketball games, G league for basketball, and minor league baseball).

Supply is also constrained since the league is effectively a cartel controlling supply (only so many teams are allowed)

vidanay 3y ago

Is there a professional sports league anywhere that is not the same?

OJFord 3y ago
GP's not saying it negatively/judgementally I don't think, it's sort of a term of art in business finance: https://www.investopedia.com/terms/c/cartel.asp https://www.investopedia.com/terms/c/cartel.asp (I say sort of because you could say it's the same word same definition just perhaps used more literally. But it certainly has a connotation to most of us that I think is how you're reading it above.)
elygre 3y ago
In many European soccer leagues, the league does not control the participants in the same way. You can start a club, and start climbing to the top.
- mcny 3y ago
  Yes, the fact that there is no relegation/promotion is strange.
  - votepaunchy 3y ago
    Only strange that the biggest European clubs failed to breakaway into their own Super League without pro/rel. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_Super_League https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_Super_League
charcircuit 3y ago
There are plenty in esports.

jrockway 3y ago

Didn't Fox start a new football league this year? I think the NFL is more of an entrenched business with great brand recognition than a cartel. College football players want an NFL contract because they trust that the NFL will be around in 10 years. (Same reason that CS grads want to work for Google and not a random startup; Google will be around in 5 years.) This means that the NFL gets first pick on the most talented players. That is what prevents upstart leagues from being successful. Players have seen what happened to competing leagues; their counterparts are now unemployed. Without good players, nobody is going to watch your thing, and thus, the NFL will continue to dominate. I think that with an infinite amount of money, you could probably create a new football league for a new generation. You will need billions of dollars to build 32 new stadiums. You will need billions of dollars to pay Patrick Mahomes $500M a year to switch sides. (x32 teams x53 players on the roster = 800 billion dollars a year in salary costs ;) Because nobody has an infinite amount of money, it's not really going to happen that way. I bet you could woo a number of viewers over by having a sane online streaming package. I want to watch every game in the season for a fixed price. No blackouts. No ads. No delay.

rsync 3y ago
The NFL has an exemption from the Sherman antitrust act. Therefore, we need not argue about whether they are or are not a cartel - or are engaging in anti-competitive behavior: our government has already defined them as such.
- jrockway 3y ago
  It's somewhat unclear if they even need the exemption. It's only relevant to TV licensing deals, and TV ain't what it used to be. The NFL mostly exists to keep the dying TV business alive, but nobody actually wants to watch the NFL on TV. If the TV deals were ruled illegal, the NFL would live and the TV stations would die.
  - thehoff 3y ago
    Maybe but I doubt the NFL would continue on the way it does without TV. They must make a ton off networks who then make it back via advertising, but maybe I’m wrong. My group of friends and I definitely watch and don’t go to games because of the cost (we would not go to games just because they are not in TV). College football around here is much more affordable (as are college basketball games, G league for basketball, and minor league baseball).