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> If someone tried this at Art Basel, it would sell for millions. If Banksy pulled off a project of this scope, he’d be hailed as a genius. Only, if it were a

> If someone tried this at Art Basel, it would sell for millions. If Banksy pulled off a project of this scope, he’d be hailed as a genius. Only, if it were a Banksy, it'd be throught-provoking, good looking art, instead of these gaudy, multi colored balloon letters

StopTheTechies 3y ago
Really? I think it adds much more to a city's character than Banksy's hokum. I'd happily pay to put this up across my local skyline.
- zoky 3y ago
  Yeah, says someone who doesn't live in Los Angeles. The only character this kind of crap adds is the kind of shady character that makes me not want to walk around Downtown at night. LA has been getting worse and worse. The Westside has been pretty much given over to drug addicts and the criminally insane. The Valley is rapidly suffering the same fate. The only reason this sort of thing even exists is pure neglect, plain and simple. If your property doesn't mean enough to you to either finish it or sell it to someone who will, then maybe you have no business owning it in the first place. Wanna bet that this property is owned by Chinese interests that don't give two shits about this city? Oh wait, that's literally in the article. What a shock.
  - tomjakubowski 3y ago
    Don't think you can speak for all city residents. I've lived in DTLA for eight years, across the street from another abandoned building. The whole time it's been graffitied from floor to roof. Like OP, I enjoy the artwork just outside my window.
    - zoky 3y ago
      I mean, I believe you, because obviously people don’t care enough about petty crime that LAPD doesn’t do crap about it (and yes, I admit that’s a cheap target, I really mean the LA City Council and more broadly, the LA County Board of Supervisors). But would you be okay admiring that art while walking around at 11:30 PM to get a gallon of milk? If so, please let me know exactly what street you live on, because speaking as a USC graduate who has lived in the LA area for the better part of four decades, I sure as hell wouldn’t.
      - tomjakubowski 3y ago
        Yes, I do routinely take late night walks around the neighborhood. Never had any problems - the worst thing is lousy drivers.
        deleted 3y ago
        [deleted]
        zoky 3y ago
        Not sure what to tell you. Only a matter of time, I guess. I once came within seconds of having to pull a knife to protect myself in that area at 2:00 AM. I can tell you, it is NOT safe.
    - RestlessMind 3y ago
      USC literally tells its students not to walk around alone at night and has a LiveSafe app which "has a useful SafeWalk function that allows friends to monitor each other when someone is en route to a destination" - https://safety.usc.edu/tips/ https://safety.usc.edu/tips/ Being an institution with thousands of students, I'd trust their take more than your random anecdote.
      - bradleyishungry 3y ago
        How does this possibly correlate to people tagging? Minor non-destructive property crime on the paint of a building is not the same as violent crime, and also the LA crime rate has been shrinking for years. Every college has campus safety guidelines as well that tend to say things like that
        oh_sigh 3y ago
        "Under the broken windows theory, an ordered and clean environment, one that is maintained, sends the signal that the area is monitored and that criminal behavior is not tolerated. Conversely, a disordered environment, one that is not maintained (broken windows, graffiti, excessive litter), sends the signal that the area is not monitored and that criminal behavior has little risk of detection." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Broken_windows_theory https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Broken_windows_theory It is 'just' a criminology theory, with many people who disagree with it.
        autoexec 3y ago
        Improving and more importantly maintaining the environments where people live does reduce crime. Most of the problems people have with broken windows theory is how it has been used to justify excessive policing that victimized people instead of improving things for them.
        zoky 3y ago
        Why do you think tagging is a thing? It’s a way for gangs to mark their turf, plain and simple. Tagging means gang activity, which means violent crime. And your assertion about the LA crime rate shrinking for years is incorrect: https://www.laalmanac.com/crime/cr01.php https://www.laalmanac.com/crime/cr01.php In fact, violent crimes reached their lowest level around 2013, and have been steadily on the rise since then.
  - StopTheTechies 3y ago
    I've heard this reactionary spiel my whole life—it's easy to be afraid. Terrible way to run a society, though.
    - zoky 3y ago
      Have you ever been mugged? You ever been put in a situation where you feared for your life? If not, climb out of your comfortable ivory tower armchair and recognize that there are bad people in this society, and you are doing nothing but enabling them for the simple reason that you, like your average teenager, have never been anyone’s victim and therefore think you’re invulnerable.
      - StopTheTechies 3y ago
        Sure, but that doesn't mean I lost my brain in the progress. Most of the bad people in society certainly aren't criminals.
    - EricE 3y ago
      Reactionary? Denial isn't just a river in Africa after all!
suction 3y ago
[dead]
thinkingemote 3y ago
> throught-provoking, good looking It is conceptual yes but it's not exactly deep in it's thinking. Good looking yes but isn't exactly provocative or beautiful in its aesthetics. Banksy is friendly and harmless and non threatening. Easy to digest and understand and appreciate. Its very understandable why his works are so valued - they are good products to be consumed. Graffiti is threatening, and is less easy to digest and understand. It's also less valued by the world. Arguably graffiti doesn't aim to be consumed as art or to be approved of by cities. Personally I would rather not see either! But as the above outlines this would be for different reasons.
- isoprophlex 3y ago
  I'm a simpleton, and no critic of art. So I'll take looking at easy to digest Banksy over the spray paint equivalent of a gang war cross-breed with a teenager yelling "MUH DICK".
  - thinkingemote 3y ago
    yes, if there was only a choice between the two options. In theory, we in western democracies have a choice what happens in our places, I would have neither. In practice and it seems that bringing up the very notion of impartiality is worse than any problem being examined, I would rather have the easily digested Banksy.
- JohnFen 3y ago
  > they are good products to be consumed. No, they are good pieces of art to be enjoyed.
hasty_pudding 3y ago
Banksy is not tribal. Banksy is not marking things for a race or gang. These markings are tribal and represent violence to people that violate these peoples turf.
- bradleyishungry 3y ago
  This is not true, the majority of tags are not gang related
bradleyishungry 3y ago
As someone who knows a lot of people who tag, they add significantly more to the character of a city while being more of a supportive community than most groups of artists, I would rather have that in my city then some random “fake deep“ piece that gets a pass because it’s more marketable.

StopTheTechies 3y ago

Really? I think it adds much more to a city's character than Banksy's hokum. I'd happily pay to put this up across my local skyline.

zoky 3y ago
Yeah, says someone who doesn't live in Los Angeles. The only character this kind of crap adds is the kind of shady character that makes me not want to walk around Downtown at night. LA has been getting worse and worse. The Westside has been pretty much given over to drug addicts and the criminally insane. The Valley is rapidly suffering the same fate. The only reason this sort of thing even exists is pure neglect, plain and simple. If your property doesn't mean enough to you to either finish it or sell it to someone who will, then maybe you have no business owning it in the first place. Wanna bet that this property is owned by Chinese interests that don't give two shits about this city? Oh wait, that's literally in the article. What a shock.
- tomjakubowski 3y ago
  Don't think you can speak for all city residents. I've lived in DTLA for eight years, across the street from another abandoned building. The whole time it's been graffitied from floor to roof. Like OP, I enjoy the artwork just outside my window.
  - zoky 3y ago
    I mean, I believe you, because obviously people don’t care enough about petty crime that LAPD doesn’t do crap about it (and yes, I admit that’s a cheap target, I really mean the LA City Council and more broadly, the LA County Board of Supervisors). But would you be okay admiring that art while walking around at 11:30 PM to get a gallon of milk? If so, please let me know exactly what street you live on, because speaking as a USC graduate who has lived in the LA area for the better part of four decades, I sure as hell wouldn’t.
    - tomjakubowski 3y ago
      Yes, I do routinely take late night walks around the neighborhood. Never had any problems - the worst thing is lousy drivers.
      - deleted 3y ago
        [deleted]
      - zoky 3y ago
        Not sure what to tell you. Only a matter of time, I guess. I once came within seconds of having to pull a knife to protect myself in that area at 2:00 AM. I can tell you, it is NOT safe.
  - RestlessMind 3y ago
    USC literally tells its students not to walk around alone at night and has a LiveSafe app which "has a useful SafeWalk function that allows friends to monitor each other when someone is en route to a destination" - https://safety.usc.edu/tips/ https://safety.usc.edu/tips/ Being an institution with thousands of students, I'd trust their take more than your random anecdote.
    - bradleyishungry 3y ago
      How does this possibly correlate to people tagging? Minor non-destructive property crime on the paint of a building is not the same as violent crime, and also the LA crime rate has been shrinking for years. Every college has campus safety guidelines as well that tend to say things like that
      - oh_sigh 3y ago
        "Under the broken windows theory, an ordered and clean environment, one that is maintained, sends the signal that the area is monitored and that criminal behavior is not tolerated. Conversely, a disordered environment, one that is not maintained (broken windows, graffiti, excessive litter), sends the signal that the area is not monitored and that criminal behavior has little risk of detection." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Broken_windows_theory https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Broken_windows_theory It is 'just' a criminology theory, with many people who disagree with it.
        autoexec 3y ago
        Improving and more importantly maintaining the environments where people live does reduce crime. Most of the problems people have with broken windows theory is how it has been used to justify excessive policing that victimized people instead of improving things for them.
      - zoky 3y ago
        Why do you think tagging is a thing? It’s a way for gangs to mark their turf, plain and simple. Tagging means gang activity, which means violent crime. And your assertion about the LA crime rate shrinking for years is incorrect: https://www.laalmanac.com/crime/cr01.php https://www.laalmanac.com/crime/cr01.php In fact, violent crimes reached their lowest level around 2013, and have been steadily on the rise since then.
- StopTheTechies 3y ago
  I've heard this reactionary spiel my whole life—it's easy to be afraid. Terrible way to run a society, though.
  - zoky 3y ago
    Have you ever been mugged? You ever been put in a situation where you feared for your life? If not, climb out of your comfortable ivory tower armchair and recognize that there are bad people in this society, and you are doing nothing but enabling them for the simple reason that you, like your average teenager, have never been anyone’s victim and therefore think you’re invulnerable.
    - StopTheTechies 3y ago
      Sure, but that doesn't mean I lost my brain in the progress. Most of the bad people in society certainly aren't criminals.
  - EricE 3y ago
    Reactionary? Denial isn't just a river in Africa after all!

suction 3y ago

[dead]

thinkingemote 3y ago

> throught-provoking, good looking It is conceptual yes but it's not exactly deep in it's thinking. Good looking yes but isn't exactly provocative or beautiful in its aesthetics. Banksy is friendly and harmless and non threatening. Easy to digest and understand and appreciate. Its very understandable why his works are so valued - they are good products to be consumed. Graffiti is threatening, and is less easy to digest and understand. It's also less valued by the world. Arguably graffiti doesn't aim to be consumed as art or to be approved of by cities. Personally I would rather not see either! But as the above outlines this would be for different reasons.

isoprophlex 3y ago
I'm a simpleton, and no critic of art. So I'll take looking at easy to digest Banksy over the spray paint equivalent of a gang war cross-breed with a teenager yelling "MUH DICK".
- thinkingemote 3y ago
  yes, if there was only a choice between the two options. In theory, we in western democracies have a choice what happens in our places, I would have neither. In practice and it seems that bringing up the very notion of impartiality is worse than any problem being examined, I would rather have the easily digested Banksy.
JohnFen 3y ago
> they are good products to be consumed. No, they are good pieces of art to be enjoyed.

hasty_pudding 3y ago

Banksy is not tribal. Banksy is not marking things for a race or gang. These markings are tribal and represent violence to people that violate these peoples turf.

bradleyishungry 3y ago
This is not true, the majority of tags are not gang related

bradleyishungry 3y ago

As someone who knows a lot of people who tag, they add significantly more to the character of a city while being more of a supportive community than most groups of artists, I would rather have that in my city then some random “fake deep“ piece that gets a pass because it’s more marketable.