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The real question is: Why does Windows cursor look "imperfect"? https://mspoweruser.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/04/windows-cursor.jpg https://mspoweruser.com/w

The real question is: Why does Windows cursor look "imperfect"? https://mspoweruser.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/04/windows-cursor.jpg https://mspoweruser.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/04/windows-c...

promiseofbeans 3y ago
I saw this somewhere the other day - the explanation I saw there was that it makes the cursor seem more balanced
- wscourge 3y ago
  I was looking at both of them for probably a little too long, and I can't see it.
simondotau 3y ago
The web page which that image is sourced from[0] and the reddit page it is in turn sourced from[1] makes a lot of hand-wavey analogies to optical balancing (which is a real phenomenon[2]) but doesn't make any compelling arguments for why they apply in this specific case. An alternative explanation is that this intentional imperfection exists to match the unavoidable imperfection which occurred when the cursor graphic was originally drawn as tiny low resolution 1-bit pixel art. It looks correct because we're used to it being slightly wrong. And when viewed at a normal size, the difference is barely perceptible anyway. [0] https://mspoweruser.com/why-windows-10s-asymmetrical-cursor-is-better/ https://mspoweruser.com/why-windows-10s-asymmetrical-cursor-... [1] https://old.reddit.com/r/TIHI/comments/fwnep0/thanks_i_hate_the_cursor/ https://old.reddit.com/r/TIHI/comments/fwnep0/thanks_i_hate_... [2] edited, thanks jusuhi
- p-e-w 3y ago
  I'm honestly not sure any explanation is needed here. Early UX design wasn't always done with as much thought and sophistication as today's software designers (are claiming to) apply. The first Windows systems had plenty of UI blunders that make the cursor thing look insignificant by comparison, and I can promise you they weren't all about "visual balance" or similar. Lots of them have carried over to later versions.
  - gjvc 3y ago
    [flagged]
  - deleted 3y ago
    [deleted]
  - treflop 3y ago
    UX may not have been as big back then but there’s nooo way no one noticed it being uneven if there was any designer involved. I just always assumed it was an artist’s style choice.
    - isleyaardvark 3y ago
      I'd assume it was a deliberate choice because I'd think it'd be easier to implement a graphic with straight lines than with lines just off enough to be noticeable.
  - troupo 3y ago
    > Early UX design wasn't always done with as much thought and sophistication as today's software designers (are claiming to) apply. Oh, but it was. Here's Apple HIG from 1987 listing extensive bibliography on the subject: https://x.com/andy_matuschak/status/1447409175596699652 https://x.com/andy_matuschak/status/1447409175596699652 (here's the full PDF: https://andymatuschak.org/files/papers/Apple%20Human%20Interface%20Guidelines%201987.pdf https://andymatuschak.org/files/papers/Apple%20Human%20Inter...) Modern "designers" apply as much thought and care as a hungry goldfish at feeding time
    - troupo 3y ago
      Or here: https://x.com/andy_matuschak/status/1447710247712280578 https://x.com/andy_matuschak/status/1447710247712280578 > there's a (pre-release) 1985 HIG that's quite different. It includes e.g. case studies (useful!), and an extended discussion of Jung's theories of intuition and how they should influence your designs (!!) The most modern "designers" read is the labels on grocery store items.
    - 3y ago
- jusuhi 3y ago
  Phenomenon. That's the singular form.
- j16sdiz 3y ago
  The article from Surur Davids is wrong. Windows cursor have an outline, the one from Mac don't.
account-5 3y ago
[flagged]
- eastbound 3y ago
  There was no patent about rounded rectangles. Please stop spreading fake news; News are sensationalized by journalists to the point the reader has an impression they said something that journalists didn’t; Do not repeat them. It’s just that Samsung was the Concordski of the Concorde, it was copying Apple’s designs to the letter, from the unboxing experience to the charger even to the home button. It was an obvious copyright infringement. https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2012/08/apples-case-that-samsung-copied-the-iphone-and-ipad-in-pictures/ https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2012/08/apples-case-that...
  - bigfudge 3y ago
    I think you are right in substance, but from memory the radius of the corners of the copy phones did form part of the court case.
    - troupo 3y ago
      Yes. It formed a part of the case. The rounded corners part was a part of the whole design package discussed.
  - nottorp 3y ago
    I didn't follow the lawsuit but i remember seeing a large cardboard model of a samsung phone in a store back then; it wasn't similar to whatever Apple was peddling at the time, it was identical. At least from like 5 m. So they may have had a point in suing.
- stouset 3y ago
  This is tired and uninformed, please just let it die. Apple was issued a design patent which is a real, common thing and is highly specific. It isn’t just patenting a roundrect and calling it a day.
mmerlin 3y ago
a recurring peeve of mine is small tooltips becoming unreadable underneath the cursor which blocks them from being read... then you move the cursor away the tooltip disappears from view... this could actually be fixed at some point in the future
gjvc 3y ago
other operating systems are available.
wolpoli 3y ago
The current high-resolution cursor seems like a scaled-up version of the original cursor. Perhaps it's that way for compatibility reason since there are tons of monitors using 100% scaling.
- ack_complete 3y ago
  At larger scale factors, Windows renders the cursor from an SVG source. It's not clear if there would be a compatibility issue with straightening the arrow image at larger scales since it uses a hardcoded .cur image at small sizes. Additionally, Windows 10/11 go to some extent to hide cursor scaling from applications. Win32 GDI/USER calls only see the base 32x32 arrow cursor and only DXGI Output Duplication (screen capture API) can see the real cursor. This causes other problems, though, such as various bugs and inconsistencies with custom cursor images.
wazoox 3y ago
Because Windows is made with poor attention to details and in a tasteless manner. For instance, when Windows XP came out, I remember clearly how some stock icons weren't properly aligned on the same baseline (it was corrected in some later SP).
- hacym 3y ago
  Fascinating! Computers didn’t exist before Windows or Windows XP!

The real question is: Why does Windows cursor look "imperfect"? https://mspoweruser.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/04/windows-cursor.jpg https://mspoweruser.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/04/windows-c...

promiseofbeans 3y ago

I saw this somewhere the other day - the explanation I saw there was that it makes the cursor seem more balanced

wscourge 3y ago
I was looking at both of them for probably a little too long, and I can't see it.

simondotau 3y ago

The web page which that image is sourced from[0] and the reddit page it is in turn sourced from[1] makes a lot of hand-wavey analogies to optical balancing (which is a real phenomenon[2]) but doesn't make any compelling arguments for why they apply in this specific case. An alternative explanation is that this intentional imperfection exists to match the unavoidable imperfection which occurred when the cursor graphic was originally drawn as tiny low resolution 1-bit pixel art. It looks correct because we're used to it being slightly wrong. And when viewed at a normal size, the difference is barely perceptible anyway. [0] https://mspoweruser.com/why-windows-10s-asymmetrical-cursor-is-better/ https://mspoweruser.com/why-windows-10s-asymmetrical-cursor-... [1] https://old.reddit.com/r/TIHI/comments/fwnep0/thanks_i_hate_the_cursor/ https://old.reddit.com/r/TIHI/comments/fwnep0/thanks_i_hate_... [2] edited, thanks jusuhi

p-e-w 3y ago
I'm honestly not sure any explanation is needed here. Early UX design wasn't always done with as much thought and sophistication as today's software designers (are claiming to) apply. The first Windows systems had plenty of UI blunders that make the cursor thing look insignificant by comparison, and I can promise you they weren't all about "visual balance" or similar. Lots of them have carried over to later versions.
- gjvc 3y ago
  [flagged]
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]
- treflop 3y ago
  UX may not have been as big back then but there’s nooo way no one noticed it being uneven if there was any designer involved. I just always assumed it was an artist’s style choice.
  - isleyaardvark 3y ago
    I'd assume it was a deliberate choice because I'd think it'd be easier to implement a graphic with straight lines than with lines just off enough to be noticeable.
- troupo 3y ago
  > Early UX design wasn't always done with as much thought and sophistication as today's software designers (are claiming to) apply. Oh, but it was. Here's Apple HIG from 1987 listing extensive bibliography on the subject: https://x.com/andy_matuschak/status/1447409175596699652 https://x.com/andy_matuschak/status/1447409175596699652 (here's the full PDF: https://andymatuschak.org/files/papers/Apple%20Human%20Interface%20Guidelines%201987.pdf https://andymatuschak.org/files/papers/Apple%20Human%20Inter...) Modern "designers" apply as much thought and care as a hungry goldfish at feeding time
  - troupo 3y ago
    Or here: https://x.com/andy_matuschak/status/1447710247712280578 https://x.com/andy_matuschak/status/1447710247712280578 > there's a (pre-release) 1985 HIG that's quite different. It includes e.g. case studies (useful!), and an extended discussion of Jung's theories of intuition and how they should influence your designs (!!) The most modern "designers" read is the labels on grocery store items.
  - 3y ago
jusuhi 3y ago
Phenomenon. That's the singular form.
j16sdiz 3y ago
The article from Surur Davids is wrong. Windows cursor have an outline, the one from Mac don't.

account-5 3y ago

[flagged]

eastbound 3y ago
There was no patent about rounded rectangles. Please stop spreading fake news; News are sensationalized by journalists to the point the reader has an impression they said something that journalists didn’t; Do not repeat them. It’s just that Samsung was the Concordski of the Concorde, it was copying Apple’s designs to the letter, from the unboxing experience to the charger even to the home button. It was an obvious copyright infringement. https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2012/08/apples-case-that-samsung-copied-the-iphone-and-ipad-in-pictures/ https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2012/08/apples-case-that...
- bigfudge 3y ago
  I think you are right in substance, but from memory the radius of the corners of the copy phones did form part of the court case.
  - troupo 3y ago
    Yes. It formed a part of the case. The rounded corners part was a part of the whole design package discussed.
- nottorp 3y ago
  I didn't follow the lawsuit but i remember seeing a large cardboard model of a samsung phone in a store back then; it wasn't similar to whatever Apple was peddling at the time, it was identical. At least from like 5 m. So they may have had a point in suing.
stouset 3y ago
This is tired and uninformed, please just let it die. Apple was issued a design patent which is a real, common thing and is highly specific. It isn’t just patenting a roundrect and calling it a day.

mmerlin 3y ago

a recurring peeve of mine is small tooltips becoming unreadable underneath the cursor which blocks them from being read... then you move the cursor away the tooltip disappears from view... this could actually be fixed at some point in the future

gjvc 3y ago

other operating systems are available.

wolpoli 3y ago

The current high-resolution cursor seems like a scaled-up version of the original cursor. Perhaps it's that way for compatibility reason since there are tons of monitors using 100% scaling.

ack_complete 3y ago
At larger scale factors, Windows renders the cursor from an SVG source. It's not clear if there would be a compatibility issue with straightening the arrow image at larger scales since it uses a hardcoded .cur image at small sizes. Additionally, Windows 10/11 go to some extent to hide cursor scaling from applications. Win32 GDI/USER calls only see the base 32x32 arrow cursor and only DXGI Output Duplication (screen capture API) can see the real cursor. This causes other problems, though, such as various bugs and inconsistencies with custom cursor images.

wazoox 3y ago

Because Windows is made with poor attention to details and in a tasteless manner. For instance, when Windows XP came out, I remember clearly how some stock icons weren't properly aligned on the same baseline (it was corrected in some later SP).

hacym 3y ago
Fascinating! Computers didn’t exist before Windows or Windows XP!