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> Serial numbers in and out of ATMs and shops are tracked Is this true? When I buy something from my local gas station is there a system in place tracking ever

> Serial numbers in and out of ATMs and shops are tracked Is this true? When I buy something from my local gas station is there a system in place tracking every serial number exchanged on the cash?

34679 3y ago
Not in the US. There are no laws requiring businesses to do so. Why would employers spend the resources required for such a thing?
- grobbyy 3y ago
  Because it's basically no resources. If they're not doing it now, they'll be doing it in a few years, and if not banned, selling the data. It's literally adding a 50 cent camera to a cash register.
  - hasty_pudding 3y ago
    where do you set up the camera to track the serial numbers and the person's identity that they're being given to?
- nonrandomstring 3y ago
  Some scenarios I hope you see as obvious: - you take out cash from an ATM. The machine is loaded with sequential or logged order of SN that can be matched to withdrawals and times. - you take that cash immediately to a vending machine or supermarket auto-checkout that takes notes. The machine scans all notes it ingests and can match them to timings and purchase details. - Even a small shop might have a camera at the till, along with a UV light frequency used to check for forgeries. Obviously as the time between withdrawal and re-appearing in a system grows the strength of the association gets lower, as notes change hands. But in a serious crime investigation that doesn't matter, it's a good-enough capability to warrant chasing.
  - seszett 3y ago
    > - you take that cash immediately to a vending machine or supermarket auto-checkout that takes notes. The machine scans all notes it ingests and can match them to timings and purchase details. I can tell you they don't do that, at least for the systems I know in Europe. And for manual systems obviously the cashier doesn't record serials and match them to transactions.
    - nonrandomstring 3y ago
      I'd love to hear more about what you know about the systems you've examined or designed. PM me at cybershow.uk and we might do an episode and bring in some other engineers too. Specifically can you prove (or give compelling anecdotes why) the linear CCD array used to determine the legitimacy of the note cannot, on internet connected machines, retain and store that scan? I know that's a tall order, because I'm asking a negative.
      - seszett 3y ago
        I haven't designed such a system and as you say I can't really prove anything, but the embedded software I worked on just didn't record anything like that. Of course one can always imagine a secret government firmware or whatever, it's just highly unlikely IMO. The most obvious proof I'd say is that there is no law mandating this, so nobody is going to bother doing it just for fun.
    - pzo 3y ago
      How about money counting machines? Medium and bigger shops probably have those and if not they probably at least every few days bring cash to bank to deposit on their account. Remember supposedly most printers were printing some semi invisible serial codes - for tracking whistleblowers and leaks. Probably cannot easily prove that ATM or money counter machines manufactures are not doing something similar.
      - multjoy 3y ago
        Money counting machines do it by weight. They're certainly not scanning and recording the serial numbers.
- hasty_pudding 3y ago
  why would the person I'm responding to say such a thing?

> Serial numbers in and out of ATMs and shops are tracked Is this true? When I buy something from my local gas station is there a system in place tracking every serial number exchanged on the cash?

34679 3y ago

Not in the US. There are no laws requiring businesses to do so. Why would employers spend the resources required for such a thing?

grobbyy 3y ago
Because it's basically no resources. If they're not doing it now, they'll be doing it in a few years, and if not banned, selling the data. It's literally adding a 50 cent camera to a cash register.
- hasty_pudding 3y ago
  where do you set up the camera to track the serial numbers and the person's identity that they're being given to?
nonrandomstring 3y ago
Some scenarios I hope you see as obvious: - you take out cash from an ATM. The machine is loaded with sequential or logged order of SN that can be matched to withdrawals and times. - you take that cash immediately to a vending machine or supermarket auto-checkout that takes notes. The machine scans all notes it ingests and can match them to timings and purchase details. - Even a small shop might have a camera at the till, along with a UV light frequency used to check for forgeries. Obviously as the time between withdrawal and re-appearing in a system grows the strength of the association gets lower, as notes change hands. But in a serious crime investigation that doesn't matter, it's a good-enough capability to warrant chasing.
- seszett 3y ago
  > - you take that cash immediately to a vending machine or supermarket auto-checkout that takes notes. The machine scans all notes it ingests and can match them to timings and purchase details. I can tell you they don't do that, at least for the systems I know in Europe. And for manual systems obviously the cashier doesn't record serials and match them to transactions.
  - nonrandomstring 3y ago
    I'd love to hear more about what you know about the systems you've examined or designed. PM me at cybershow.uk and we might do an episode and bring in some other engineers too. Specifically can you prove (or give compelling anecdotes why) the linear CCD array used to determine the legitimacy of the note cannot, on internet connected machines, retain and store that scan? I know that's a tall order, because I'm asking a negative.
    - seszett 3y ago
      I haven't designed such a system and as you say I can't really prove anything, but the embedded software I worked on just didn't record anything like that. Of course one can always imagine a secret government firmware or whatever, it's just highly unlikely IMO. The most obvious proof I'd say is that there is no law mandating this, so nobody is going to bother doing it just for fun.
  - pzo 3y ago
    How about money counting machines? Medium and bigger shops probably have those and if not they probably at least every few days bring cash to bank to deposit on their account. Remember supposedly most printers were printing some semi invisible serial codes - for tracking whistleblowers and leaks. Probably cannot easily prove that ATM or money counter machines manufactures are not doing something similar.
    - multjoy 3y ago
      Money counting machines do it by weight. They're certainly not scanning and recording the serial numbers.
hasty_pudding 3y ago
why would the person I'm responding to say such a thing?