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Personally I find private land ownership a kind of ridiculous concept. Our current system provides the convenient and necessary fiction of land ownership but ul

Personally I find private land ownership a kind of ridiculous concept. Our current system provides the convenient and necessary fiction of land ownership but ultimately to the extent there is an owner, it is always the state.

rufus_foreman 3y ago
Are you alluding to real estate taxes, or something else? I know that you have to pay property tax to keep your land, but you have to pay property tax to keep your car, and I don't see how that means that the state owns your car. I think the current system, and specifically the Supreme Court under Roberts has done an excellent job protecting individual property rights from the state. The Roberts court gets criticized for protecting those rights too much.
- bradlys 3y ago
  You don’t pay property tax to keep your car. You pay registration fees to drive your car on public roads. You can still drive that car on racetracks and other such places. The car/house comparison doesn’t make any sense here. You don’t own the land and never will. You just lease it from the government and we all get that.
  - rufus_foreman 3y ago
    >> You don’t pay property tax to keep your car I pay property tax to keep my car. I get a yearly bill based on the value of my car, and I pay taxes based on that. I pay property tax to keep my house. I get a yearly bill based on the value of my house and I pay taxes based on that. The car/house comparison makes sense here because I get a bill in the mail for property tax on my house and I get a bill in the mail for property tax on my car, they are from the same locality in two different envelopes. I own the land. I own the car, I get property tax bills for both of them in the mail every year, they are precisely 100% the exact same.
    - bradlys 3y ago
      > I pay property tax to keep my car. I get a yearly bill based on the value of my car, and I pay taxes based on that. I pay property tax to keep my house. I get a yearly bill based on the value of my house and I pay taxes based on that. In the US? This isn't common. I've heard of things like this to register your car but not to keep it. There's no laws in the USA where they'll repossess your car if you don't pay registration fees. They just don't allow it to be on the road legally and you'll get ticketed.
      - rufus_foreman 3y ago
        >> In the US? This isn't common It's state by state: https://wallethub.com/edu/states-with-the-highest-and-lowest-property-taxes/11585 https://wallethub.com/edu/states-with-the-highest-and-lowest...
        bradlys 3y ago
        I own vehicles in CA. There is no property tax for vehicles in CA. I can guarantee you that. I specifically own vehicles that I don’t renew with the state and there’s no problems with that.
        rufus_foreman 3y ago
        Do you pay a vehicle license fee on those vehicles?
        bradlys 3y ago
        I don't pay anything, man. That's my point. I don't have to as long as I don't put them on public roads. You can race them on the track or do whatever you want with them.
ch4s3 3y ago
Why is a nation-state any less farcical to you than private land ownership? Its even more abstract and far removed from material reality.
- wolverine876 3y ago
  It's chosen and controlled by the citizens. Private land ownership is chosen and controlled by the owner. I support the latter, and protection of their rights, but the former certainly has more legitimacy.
  - ch4s3 3y ago
    Is a nation state necessarily chosen and controlled by citizens? Individual property rights predate nation states by thousands of years.
    - wolverine876 3y ago
      Agreed, I'm talking about democracies.

rufus_foreman 3y ago

Are you alluding to real estate taxes, or something else? I know that you have to pay property tax to keep your land, but you have to pay property tax to keep your car, and I don't see how that means that the state owns your car. I think the current system, and specifically the Supreme Court under Roberts has done an excellent job protecting individual property rights from the state. The Roberts court gets criticized for protecting those rights too much.

bradlys 3y ago
You don’t pay property tax to keep your car. You pay registration fees to drive your car on public roads. You can still drive that car on racetracks and other such places. The car/house comparison doesn’t make any sense here. You don’t own the land and never will. You just lease it from the government and we all get that.
- rufus_foreman 3y ago
  >> You don’t pay property tax to keep your car I pay property tax to keep my car. I get a yearly bill based on the value of my car, and I pay taxes based on that. I pay property tax to keep my house. I get a yearly bill based on the value of my house and I pay taxes based on that. The car/house comparison makes sense here because I get a bill in the mail for property tax on my house and I get a bill in the mail for property tax on my car, they are from the same locality in two different envelopes. I own the land. I own the car, I get property tax bills for both of them in the mail every year, they are precisely 100% the exact same.
  - bradlys 3y ago
    > I pay property tax to keep my car. I get a yearly bill based on the value of my car, and I pay taxes based on that. I pay property tax to keep my house. I get a yearly bill based on the value of my house and I pay taxes based on that. In the US? This isn't common. I've heard of things like this to register your car but not to keep it. There's no laws in the USA where they'll repossess your car if you don't pay registration fees. They just don't allow it to be on the road legally and you'll get ticketed.
    - rufus_foreman 3y ago
      >> In the US? This isn't common It's state by state: https://wallethub.com/edu/states-with-the-highest-and-lowest-property-taxes/11585 https://wallethub.com/edu/states-with-the-highest-and-lowest...
      - bradlys 3y ago
        I own vehicles in CA. There is no property tax for vehicles in CA. I can guarantee you that. I specifically own vehicles that I don’t renew with the state and there’s no problems with that.
        rufus_foreman 3y ago
        Do you pay a vehicle license fee on those vehicles?
        bradlys 3y ago
        I don't pay anything, man. That's my point. I don't have to as long as I don't put them on public roads. You can race them on the track or do whatever you want with them.

ch4s3 3y ago

Why is a nation-state any less farcical to you than private land ownership? Its even more abstract and far removed from material reality.

wolverine876 3y ago
It's chosen and controlled by the citizens. Private land ownership is chosen and controlled by the owner. I support the latter, and protection of their rights, but the former certainly has more legitimacy.
- ch4s3 3y ago
  Is a nation state necessarily chosen and controlled by citizens? Individual property rights predate nation states by thousands of years.
  - wolverine876 3y ago
    Agreed, I'm talking about democracies.